String height at the nut

**carleshicks** · Dec-16-2014, 8:43pm

I need to raise the string height at the nut by .003" to .005". I have a back buzz on my G string and a fuzzy sounding A open string. When I fret any of my strings on the third fret the string is sitting on the first fret. I want to place a piece of off-white paper that is about .005" thick under the nut. I tried to remove the pearl nut by resting a small wood block against it and smacking it towards the headstock with a small hammer, but it would not budge. Any pointers?

**sunburst** · Dec-16-2014, 9:13pm

"Smacking it" sort of makes me cringe!
Try tapping it lightly first one way then the other to see if it will break loose. Someone might have glued it so securely that it is really stuck. Some people seem to think the the nut needs to be glued securely enough to attach a tow hitch to and use it to pull the camper to the festival, when in fact, it just needs to be stuck enough to stay in place. So assuming you successfully remove it with no damage, put it back in place with only a spot or two of glue against the end of the fingerboard.
If all else fails, try sawing a kerf with the thinnest razor say you can find, right behind the nut...
Since a picture is worth well over 1000 words (my words, anyway) I checked with Frets.com, and sure enough, here are instructions with pictures!
http://www.frets.com/FretsPages/Luth...t/newnut1.html

I have a razor saw that cuts a .008" kerf and that is what I use for stubborn nuts.

**carleshicks** · Dec-16-2014, 9:33pm

"Smacking" may not have been the right word to use, the idea of the razor saw is exactly what I needed. Thank you.

**Michael Lewis** · Dec-17-2014, 2:48am

Once you get the old glue off it and flatten the bottom surface super glue the paper to the bottom of the nut. Only after it is dry should you glue it to the fingerboard, and keep glue out of the bottom of the nut slot.

MOP nuts are rather brittle, so care should be taken to avoid breaking it. It may break anyway, then you get to make a new one.

**bart mcneil** · Dec-17-2014, 7:28am

Be especially cautious if it is on the snake head as they were likely using actual ivory nuts at that time. Assuming that the nut is original.

**carleshicks** · Dec-17-2014, 7:32am

Thanks, It is actually on my Master Model so it is pearl. I definitely would not want to ruin the ivory nut on the snakehead.

**HoGo** · Dec-17-2014, 3:55pm

Originally Posted by carleshicks

Thanks, It is actually on my Master Model so it is pearl. I definitely would not want to ruin the ivory nut on the snakehead.

Gibson often finished over the nut so it is probably finish that glued it in place. Make sure you score finish around the nut with tip of very sharp knife to prevent chipping of surrounding finish during removal.

**Hendrik Ahrend** · Dec-17-2014, 4:44pm

The original nut on my DMM (2005) was glued in with CA glue - actually shimmed quite a bit. I made the stupid mistake of tapping it loose in the direction of the head stock, which caused a thump nail size piece of head stock veneer to chip off. It's reglued, but Carles, don't do that.

**carleshicks** · Dec-17-2014, 9:38pm

Originally Posted by Henry Eagle

The original nut on my DMM (2005) was glued in with CA glue - actually shimmed quite a bit. I made the stupid mistake of tapping it loose in the direction of the head stock, which caused a thump nail size piece of head stock veneer to chip off. It's reglued, but Carles, don't do that.

What do you recommend? Filling the grooves in the nut and then re-filing to a new depth?

**Steve Sorensen** · Dec-17-2014, 11:28pm

A piece of printer paper is about 0.003. Glue a little strip of paper to the underside of the nut then reinstall.
Steve

**Tom Wright** · Dec-18-2014, 12:49am

I followed a suggestion from someone here and used an Exacto knife to cut the finish at the nut to avoid chipping. Worked great when tapping the nut loose.

**HoGo** · Dec-18-2014, 3:52am

Originally Posted by Henry Eagle

The original nut on my DMM (2005) was glued in with CA glue - actually shimmed quite a bit. I made the stupid mistake of tapping it loose in the direction of the head stock, which caused a thump nail size piece of head stock veneer to chip off. It's reglued, but Carles, don't do that.

Tapping in direction against headstock is actually safest. You need to make sure the nut is not overly tight against overlay or finish of headstock (scoring the finish or razor sawing behind nut is recommended) and tap very lightly. Somemakers just don't realize it will sooner or later need removed (e.g. gor full refret with f/b planing) and glue the nuts way too tightly with lots of glue and even finish over it to make this simple procedure. Tapping to side will very likely result in umpredictable chipping of edges of fingerboard binding or headstock edges.

**Hendrik Ahrend** · Dec-18-2014, 5:13pm

Originally Posted by HoGo

Tapping in direction against headstock is actually safest. You need to make sure the nut is not overly tight against overlay or finish of headstock (scoring the finish or razor sawing behind nut is recommended) and tap very lightly. Somemakers just don't realize it will sooner or later need removed (e.g. gor full refret with f/b planing) and glue the nuts way too tightly with lots of glue and even finish over it to make this simple procedure. Tapping to side will very likely result in umpredictable chipping of edges of fingerboard binding or headstock edges.

Thanks, Adrian, tapping very lightly is the key. On two other recent Gibsons I scored the finish around the nut and tapped the nut loose from the treble side. For safety, I clamped a block of wood to the bass side of the fret board.

**Jeff Mando** · Dec-18-2014, 5:34pm

I'm not sure if we are on the same page. .003" is very very small--a hair, as they say. Sometimes instead of going that way, I will just seep some super glue into the slots and let it dry. It will just add a tiny layer to the bottom of the slot and sometimes that is all you need to make a big difference. It is easy to make a mess with super glue, a little goes a long way. Might be what ya need.

**pops1** · Dec-18-2014, 7:07pm

If you use superglue it doesn't harden well by itself. If i use it on ebony nuts i use ebony dust, bone nuts bone dust, you get the idea. you could use glue and dust if you have a small piece of pearl, baking soda or something similar to bind with the super glue will harden quite hard and work for nut slots also tho i prefer the dust.

**Marty Jacobson** · Dec-18-2014, 8:30pm

This thread has confirmed me in my practice of not gluing nuts in or finishing over them...

**carleshicks** · Dec-18-2014, 9:45pm

I thought of trying super glue and baking soda or some kind of powder, but I wasn't sure it would be hard enough. Il try it first before I remove the nut. I can always file it out, back to original depth if I end up having to remove the nut.

**Michael Lewis** · Dec-19-2014, 1:47am

Filling the nut slots with CA is only a stop gap measure. It can get you through a gig, maybe, and maybe a bit longer, but the strings need to be seated on the solid material of the nut, be it pearl or bone.

**BJ O'Day** · Dec-19-2014, 6:58am

Common paper used in desktop printers is about 0.004". I wonder if it is too porous and could change thickness with humidity, maybe it wouldn't matter. I used to work in a print shop and they had a special paper called onion skin. It was used to shim under printing plates and impression blankets. It came in a variety of thicknesses and was very dimensionally stable.

BJ

**carleshicks** · Dec-20-2014, 6:28pm

Well I got it out without any problems, I added a piece of paper that was about .0045" thick. It created about .003" of clearance over the first fret while holding at the third.
Here are a few pictures.