Vintage Washburn front-mounted tuners

**CervenySatek** · Mar-24-2005, 7:50pm

Well this is probably a long shot, but...

Somebody gave me an old Washburn bowlback that's missing a tuner bracket. I thought I'd probably only use it for parts or something, but when I strung up the G and D strings on it, the tone was suprisingly rich and resonating. Now I'm curious what the E and A sound like, but I need a tuner bracket for it. Can anyone tell me if they know of any place that collects vintage parts? If not, can anyone think of a way I could rig this up easily with some other tuner?

(I thought I'd attach a pic, but I guess it has to come from a web page. Basically, they're front-mounted with sharp pointed pegs)

Anybody?

**CervenySatek** · Mar-24-2005, 7:51pm

I forgot to say, that it's a bowl-back...

**Bob A** · Mar-24-2005, 8:23pm

You might post a picture in the classical section for good advice.

You might find parts at www.bernunzio.com; but a picture sent there would also aid the search.

**Bob DeVellis** · Mar-24-2005, 9:00pm

John Bernunzio at bernunzio.com has lots of odd bits and pieces, although this one sounds like quite a challenge.

**Eugene** · Mar-24-2005, 10:55pm

First, good luck. Vintage hardware is tough. Second, I gotsta see a picture or few. Can you post here?

**Paul Hostetter** · Mar-25-2005, 2:00pm

L&H, maker of the Washburn, spewed millions of mandolins like that back in the day. Whether it's front or back mounting, the gears inside have lots of company in spare parts boxes around the continent. What is a "tuner bracket" though? I'm trying to imagine what part you're actually missing. This term isn't in my glossary.

**Martin Jonas** · Mar-25-2005, 2:16pm

Originally Posted by (CervenySatek @ Mar. 24 2005, 20:50)

(I thought I'd attach a pic, but I guess it has to come from a web page. Basically, they're front-mounted with sharp pointed pegs)

The easy way to post pictures from your hard drive is to ignore the "Image" button just above the text window and to use "File Attachments", right at the bottom of the composing web page, instead. To do this, you must post using the "Add Reply", "Quote" or "New Topic" buttons; it won't work with the "Quick Reply" section at the bottom of the screen.

Martin

**Paul Hostetter** · Mar-25-2005, 2:47pm

OK, I tried to figure out your instructions, and it finally worked. Thanks, I wondered how people were doing that. I think it's easiest if you hit the "add reply" button on a post in the thread first, in order to access the possibility of attaching a file direct from your hard drive.

Here's an Iucci double-top, in case you're wondering. This is a test, this is only a test. Had this been an actual emergency...

**CervenySatek** · Mar-25-2005, 2:48pm

OK, I think I get the image upload process now, but I'm not at the right PC. I'll post it tonight or tomorrow. Until then, the tuners themselves look this the ones from this website, although I can't tell if the pegs are pointed or not:

http://www.vintage-instruments.com/navigate/catidx7.htm

See the pics for: 25. LYON & HEALY COMPANY (PROBABLY), Mandolin, c.1900

Sorry, I don't know the exact terminology, but by "tuner bracket", I just mean the combination of the pegs, tuner handles and metal plate, for one side of the peghead.

**CervenySatek** · Mar-25-2005, 3:02pm

Oh yeah, I guess I should've just done that...

Yes, the tuners look very similar to that.

**Paul Hostetter** · Mar-25-2005, 3:03pm

If the whole strip of gears is missing, per the attached photo, you have an issue. You may end up having to find a whole matched set, right and left, and fitting them. I'll look and see if I have anything, but offhand I think all my odd sets are rear-mounted.

**CervenySatek** · Mar-25-2005, 3:07pm

Yes, unfortunately the whole strip of gears is missing. I have most of the left one, but not the right.

Thanks...

**Paul Hostetter** · Mar-25-2005, 3:29pm

Most? It's a discrete unit, so what's missing from the G-D side? You really need to post some actual photos!

**CervenySatek** · Mar-25-2005, 5:28pm

Sorry, I meant "most" a bit tongue-in-cheek. It's missing a handle on the one unit I have. Here's a pic...

**CervenySatek** · Mar-25-2005, 5:30pm

and from the side...

**Paul Hostetter** · Mar-25-2005, 5:38pm

Aha, now we're getting somewhere.

Buttons were bone, not hard to replace. I am out the door for the weekend and won't have time to even look in my heap until Monday or so. If this drifts, feel free to contact me offlist to give me a nudge.

**Eugene** · Mar-25-2005, 5:43pm

This looks to be a rather early L&H Washburn, probably still 19th century. Washburn went to celluloid tuning buttons in the 1890s. I am really pining for a full spread of images! Can you transcribe the label and describe the bowl's liner (if any). Lined with black cloth isn't so old, lined with tan parchment is rather old, and featuring an odd x-brace across the bowl with a logo-sporting medallion is mighty old. Label text will help narrow date as well.

**CervenySatek** · Mar-26-2005, 10:36am

OK, I'm sending up some pics...

Eugene, there is no liner. There are just 2 x-braces, one of which has a wood logo that reads "George Washburn", with a little picture of a parlor guitar. I can't see any writing or serial numbers anywhere. The back strips are rosewood, and I guess maple (it has that curving pattern).

Unfortunately, it has a long top-crack. (By the way, is fixing a top-crack supposed to improve the sound, or does it just keep it from cracking more, thereby keeping it from sounding worse? )

Otherwise, the action seems fine, and the neck looks quite straight to me. The bridge, nut and tailpiece look to me like they could be original. The width at the cant is a little over 8 inches. The length from 10th fret to end of body under the tailpiece is 12.5 inches.

OK, here come the pics...

**CervenySatek** · Mar-26-2005, 10:37am

and the front (it looks a lot more dingy on the photos)

**CervenySatek** · Mar-26-2005, 10:40am

logo

**CervenySatek** · Mar-26-2005, 10:41am

back neck

**CervenySatek** · Mar-26-2005, 10:43am

back

**Eugene** · Mar-26-2005, 12:32pm

Stunning! #It looks like the clasp is bookmatched: that's funky. #This is a rather low-end or mid-range instrument in the grand scheme of their catalogue. #Not having a catalogue of that era on hand, maybe a style 73 or 74 (Neil Russell or Keef could probably pinpoint it if they happen by). #Still, this is of the very first, and I think absolutely coolest, generation of Washburn mandolins. #Washburn introduced their mandolin line in 1889. #By 1892, the wooden medallion that labeled mandolins read "George Wasburn, New Model." #This places yours as a likely vintage of 1889-1892. #Very cool!

Yes, the ribs are alternating rosewood and maple. #And yes, please get the top crack tended; yours looks to have no separation and its repair should be cheap and trivial. #I suspect that locating a replacement front-mounted tuner plate wil be tough. #Good luck! #Monitor eBay with diligence and write every vintage dealer you can find (starting with Bernunzio and Scotty at Top Shelf Music).

**keef** · Mar-28-2005, 1:58am

These pre 1892 Washburns are confusing, at least to me. This headstock shape was used on the three most expensive models (75, 76 and 80). These also had the top loaded tuners.
Your mando seems to have 19 ribs (?). According to the 1889 catalog the 75 and 76 had 17 (the 80 was all rosewood, and had 35 ribs)...the top marquetry is clearly a 76, but the neck inlays are different from the catalog picture, and the headstock should have a pearl flower shaped inlay.

Neil Russell has quite a few of these old ones. Surviving Washburns from this period often do not look identical to the catalog pictures - so my guess would be a Style 76.

Can you find a serial number? It should be stamped inside the body on the neck block.

**Jim Garber** · Mar-28-2005, 10:11am

Originally Posted by (Paul Hostetter @ Mar. 25 2005, 15:47)

Here's an Iucci double-top, in case you're wondering.

Hey Paul:
That is one interesting mandolin. Can you comment on the construction, etc. Do you won that one? I am somewhat familiar with Iucci instruments. More pics?

Thanks
Jim