D'Addario EXP... too sticky for you?

[terzinator]

I feel like I got the wrong set of strings in the package!

I love medium Elixirs, but wanted to try a slightly beefier gauge on my MT, but Elixir doesn't make one. So I picked up a set of coated D'Addario EXP75's to try. (.0115 - .041)

I really like the tone, but sliding on them is horrible. Grabby and squeaky as all get out. (The slippery coating is why I like elixirs, obviously.)

So, is it just me? Anyone else find the EXP's to be not so slippery? Before using Elixirs, I used the tried-and-true J74's, and I think the J74's were more easily slide-able than the EXPs. So maybe next I'll try a set of the J75s.

I really wish Elixir made an .0115 - .041 set.

[Tobin]

I used Elixirs for several years, but the search for better tone led me away from them. I agree that EXPs are less slick than Elixirs, but in my experience they're still way easier to slide on than J74s. Going back to Elixirs now, I think they're too slippery. The EXPs have the ideal amount of friction for me: not too grabby but not too slick either.

[Polecat]

It isn't just you, I had exactly the same experience with EXPs - great tone, but nowhere near as comfortable to play as Elixirs, or even the "normal" J74/75s, although they do not corrode as fast as the uncoated strings. I have also tried Cleartone coated strings (I believe they are the only strings where the plain strings are also coated), and did not find that they measured up against the Elixirs, either in terms of tone or ease of playing. The only strings I have used that come up to Elixirs standard as regards comfort that sounded as good or better (admittedly a subjective judgement) were Thomastiks (prohibitively expensive) or d'Orazio silver-plated (no longer available). For the moment I'm sticking to the Elixirs.

[Mandoplumb]

I tried the Elixirs when they first came out, IMHO they sounded awful, way too thin too " new " sounding. Made me wonder if they really last longer or just seem like it.

[Pete Braccio]

The EXP74s feel about as "grabby" as J74s to me. I rub my finger tips along the side of my nose to pick up a bit of skin oil and that helps to lessen that grabby sensation. It doesn't sound pretty, but it works.

Pete

[9lbShellhamer]

I agree that the EXP's are less slick than the Elixirs, and I also think the A and E strings tarnish out quicker on EXP than the Elixirs do.

That being said, on my "nice" mando I like the sound of Elixirs better and on my travel/campfire/beater I prefer the sound of EXP's. It's funny that each model prefers it's own string for best sound quality and tone.

If I use Elixirs on my less pricey Kentucky, (the travel/beater), its like I only hear lows and highs, not much mid. the EXP's however bloom nicely and give a full tonal character which blossoms nicely.

On my "nice" mando, The Elixirs provide a great full tone lows,mids, and highs. The bass sounds more "thumpy" like I like and less metallic.

[Phil Goodson]

I agree with you about how EXPs feel. I don't care for coated strings much, but if I had to play them all the time, I'd use the Cleartone coated strings. I think they feel closest to noncoated, at least not sticky feeling.

[terzinator]

Well, seems there's a lot of agreement on this. I went back to Elixirs today because I just hated the feel of the EXP's.

Sad to say, that EXP tone was fuller/louder, but it might have been simply the heavier gauge.

Open request to Elixir: Please make your strings in a .0115 - .041 gauge!

[LongBlackVeil]

Weird I never noticed this, I guess because exps have been my chosen strings since I started (exp77s) I didn't like elixirs on my mandolin for the same reason I didn't like them on my guitars. Way too slippery and thinner, brighter tone that takes a long time to warm up

[Drew Egerton]

The EXP74s feel about as "grabby" as J74s to me. I rub my finger tips along the side of my nose to pick up a bit of skin oil and that helps to lessen that grabby sensation. It doesn't sound pretty, but it works.

Pete

Reminds me of a Steve Kaufman guitar DVD I had a few years ago. He said he told a student to get some "forehead grease" on his fingers to help slide better. The student's mom came back and later and said "My son does not HAVE forehead grease!"

[Cheryl Watson]

Ha! I have heard about the forehead grease solution.

The EXPs feel just a touch "grabby" to me also, but if you can lightening the fretting hand/finger grip, seems to help with any strings, in my experience. When I slide and move around on the fretboard it needs to be almost like you are on ice. It has even helped several of my students to say to themselves "On ice" when they play. If your grip is already pretty loose and you are not pressing too hard on the strings, then "Fast Fret" might help you--just wipe it on the strings.

[Polecat]

...If your grip is already pretty loose and you are not pressing too hard on the strings, then "Fast Fret" might help you--just wipe it on the strings.

Does anybody here have experience with "Fast Fret" and coated strings? I know from experience that using "Nevrdull" or Isopropanol to clean strings attacks the coating, and is a bad idea.

[Tobin]

Does anybody here have experience with "Fast Fret" and coated strings? I know from experience that using "Nevrdull" or Isopropanol to clean strings attacks the coating, and is a bad idea.

I use Fast Fret, but only on the plain strings. I do it to keep rust at bay, not as a playing aid. So I don't typically apply it to the coated (wound) strings. But occasionally it does get on them due to the size of the applicator. I've never noticed any sort of ill effects on the coating. Fast Fret is just mineral oil, after all. Very harmless.

[sblock]

I feel like I got the wrong set of strings in the package!
...

I really like the tone, but sliding on them is horrible. Grabby and squeaky as all get out. (The slippery coating is why I like elixirs, obviously.)

So, is it just me? Anyone else find the EXP's to be not so slippery? Before using Elixirs, I used the tried-and-true J74's, and I think the J74's were more easily slide-able than the EXPs. So maybe next I'll try a set of the J75s.

Well, many of us have never experienced any "stickiness" or "grabiness" at all with D'Addario EXP74 coated phosphor bronze strings. On the contrary, these seem to slide smoothly under the finger. Not that I have any reason at all to doubt your veracity or question your experience, mind you! I suspect this is a strong function of personal body chemistry. Some folks have to use coated strings, because if they didn't, their strings would corrode very quickly. This is due to larger-then-usual deposits of salty perspiration that come from their fingers and hands. I suspect that personal body chemistry ALSO has a lot to do with whether you experience "grabiness" in playing coated strings. And, of course, it will depend upon the exact nature of the compounds used to coat the strings. These compounds tend to be proprietary/secret, so we can only guess what they might be (usually polymers/plastics). Anyway, EXP74's work -- fortunately -- for the majority of us, without grabbing or squeaking. But evidently, not for a few.

[ddawson2010]

Don from D'Addario here - there is a substantial difference in our coated strings (EXP) and that of our competitor. We actually coat the wrap wire so that the string feels more like a traditional instrument string. Our competitors coats the entire length of the string, which is reason why you have that slippery feeling over the entire length of the string.

Our effort is to create a string that feel more like an uncoated string. Preferences will be preferences

[TonyP]

I hate to sound like a broken record because I've mentioned this elsewhere but the stuff I discovered is String Swipes by John Pearse. They are little pads in nice little plastic sealed cup and they are infused with De Oxit which is wonderful non toxic stuff. So you don't hose down your instrument with a spray, you just wipe it on with the swipes. I use my left hand to apply it with so I have some on my finger tips. With new strings especially you can see the pad pull off black oxidation and it almost immediately gets rid of the new string rattle/clank I hate. Once the strings have been treated a couple of times and I don't see anymore oxidation coming off on the pad I can get several treatments out of the same pad so it's very economical for me. Also the sealed cup has a screw on lid and is the perfect size to fit in the storage box in my cases. New strings seem to come oxidized in my experience and this gets rid of and does not seem to harm anything, being non toxic. As part of a string change I'll work the pad into the string slots too as it gets out all the accumulated oxidation and lubes the slot making for easier tuning.

I first got this because when I get nervous my sweat just eats up strings and my fingers stick. By the end of a gig I'd have killed a new set of strings. This stops that completely. NFI YMMV.

[Don Grieser]

I notice just a bit of grabbiness when I first put EXP74s on. I don't think its any more than J74s. It seems to go away for me rather quickly. I go back and forth between J74s and EXP74s, and I've never liked the sound or feel of Elixers.

[Joey Anchors]

I recently converted over to Pyramid Pure Nickel Classics and loving the tone so far. Slightly warmer than J74s, easier to play due to the lower tension of the round core/pure nickel wound, and they stay in tune much better than PB strings

No stickiness at all either!

[terzinator]

Don from D'Addario here - there is a substantial difference in our coated strings (EXP) and that of our competitor. We actually coat the wrap wire so that the string feels more like a traditional instrument string. Our competitors coats the entire length of the string, which is reason why you have that slippery feeling over the entire length of the string.

Our effort is to create a string that feel more like an uncoated string. Preferences will be preferences

Thank you for taking the time to reply, Don! Much appreciated!

Yep, I had heard that about the EXPs vs Elixirs, and the coating technique. I really do miss the tone from those EXP75s, so I might just have to buy them again, and try the String Swipes stuff that TonyP mentioned.

Also, I might start a new thread on this topic (depending on the responses I get here), but has anyone tried the D'Addario EJ75 strings? Uncoated, it appears. And phosphor-bronze, like the J75's. (When I was on Amazon's J75 page, there was a panel on the page that said "There is a newer version of this product." And it went to the page for EJ75 strings.) Anyone?

[terzinator]

hmmm... a quick google search turns up very little on D'Addario "EJ" strings. Nothing on Elderly or Just Strings or even D'Addario's site.

The packaging looks dated, and shipping is weeks out.

I wonder if they even make them anymore? (And really are the same as -- or were replaced by -- the J74/J75?)

[TonyP]

Chris, while I do value my fellow mandolin players findings/opinions I've found its all so subjective and conditional it only supplies me with new options. Not necessarily fixes. Strings and picks are such a huge daunting field it's no wonder it seems like half the threads here are about them.

So even if I read a review it still remains for me to try. My next big string experiment is with the new Siminoff Straight Up Strings Heavys. 11.5. 017. 026. 041. I see nothing about coating on the package so dunno. I got these as a sample(thanks Roger) along with a new sample of EXP 75's (thanks Frank Solivan) while at IBMA.

For the record I've tried monels and had to change out the e and a's to get them right so gave up on them. Couldn't stand Elixers, same for Tomastik Starks. Have mostly used EXP 74's but then wanted a stronger sound and tried EXP 75. I liked what they did especially e and a courses but had a hard time with the harder string pressure. So like most things with me when I start experimenting I'm really lost for a while. Hopefully this new experiment will provide me with a place to land for a while.

[terzinator]

Oh, I hear ya.

I used J74's for years, and tried the elixirs, and liked the coated feel and longevity... Just that I wanted to try a HEAVIER gauge than Elixir provided, so I tried the EXP75's. All without firing up a post about it.

But it was just the fact that the EXP's, while coated, seemed to be so sticky/grabby, that I just had to find out if others had the same experience. I simply don't remember the regular J74's feeling as grabby as the EXP's.

I know there are tons of threads on "What strings should I try?" (and they kinda make my head spin, too... like, "it's only a few bucks! Try 'em, and if you don't like 'em, try something else!"

So, yeah, not looking for a fix (although that String Swipe idea might provide something of one) or a "make my decision for me!" thing...

Anyway, no worries, I'm mostly just on a "do anything but actual work today" procrastination exercise.

[Tobin]

I used J74's for years, and tried the elixirs, and liked the coated feel and longevity... Just that I wanted to try a HEAVIER gauge than Elixir provided, so I tried the EXP75's. All without firing up a post about it.

But it was just the fact that the EXP's, while coated, seemed to be so sticky/grabby, that I just had to find out if others had the same experience. I simply don't remember the regular J74's feeling as grabby as the EXP's.

If you went from J74s to Elixirs to EXP75s, I would suspect that the 'grabbiness' of the EXPs was comparatively strong versus the Elixirs. But if you really did follow this order of strings, it may be difficult to remember how the J74s felt compared to the EXPs, since the Elixirs were used in the interim.

Any chance you could string up J74s on one mandolin and EXP74s on another, to compare them side-by-side (and using the same gauge so that doesn't become a factor)? I'd be really surprised if you still found the EXPs to be more grabby than J74s when compared next to each other.

[TonyP]

LOL I'm in that mode too.

I can't remember what I paid for the swipes but for me they have fixed so many things. And after reading the re by Don it makes a little more sense about how EXP are different. It's still a little shocking to see oxidization in the form of black stuff come off new strings with the swipes. But the way it breaks in new string so quickly and after a couple of swipes the oxidization doesn't seem to come back I think it's a great tool. Good luck with your search.

[terzinator]

My next big string experiment is with the new Siminoff Straight Up Strings Heavys. 11.5. 017. 026. 041. I see nothing about coating on the package so dunno.

I am officially a string hypochondriac. (Or neurotic. Or psychopath.)

I had read about Siminoff's S-U strings, and I put them in the back of my mind for a possible audition some day... so my interest was piqued when you mentioned the heavier gauge.

I went ahead and ordered some, and I just put them on last night.

Really nice tone and playability. I can't say for sure that they're as loud as the EXP75's, but they're louder (and I like the tone more) than the Elixirs. It's so subjective, obviously, but it seems richer and fuller and snappier. Whatever that all means. It could be that I like the Phosphor-Bronze tone (both Siminoff and D'Addario) better than the 80/20 tone (Elixir) on mandolin. Or it could simply be that the heavier gauge brings out a slightly different voicing, regardless of composition.

(For guitars, I like PB on rosewood and 80/20 on mahogany, but that's another story.)

Anyway, they feel much smoother than the EXP75's when sliding. I'm assuming they're non-coated, but they're not sticky/grabby at all.

It's only been one evening, and I'll let 'em settle in a few days before passing further judgment, but I like 'em. I have a sneaking suspicion, though, that I might wind up landing on D'Addario's regular, plain-jane J strings -- the J75's specifically. Just because they're so cheap, and available, and Occam's Razor and all that.

But this might take a while. Hypochondriacs are rarely cured overnight.

If ever.