how do you train yourself to solo

[festus01]

I am new to Mandolin Café and playing the mandolin, I play in a gospel bluegrass band and we needed a mandolin player so they asked me to learn the mandolin. I love playing it but I can chop and play rhythm and I am learning my scales and some fiddle tunes, but from you guys that know, what is the best approach to learn to do lead breaks the fastest so that I can do my part in our band. I just want to do a good job and take some leads since we are representing GODS word and ministry. thanks for any and all advice.

[LongBlackVeil]

These 4 patterns here have helped me the most. They are movable so that you can use them in any key

http://jazzmando.com/ffcp.shtml

I know it says jazz mando but these patterns are very basic and can be used in all styles of music.

[Tobin]

what is the best approach to learn to do lead breaks the fastest

The best approach is to learn to do them slowly first. I know, that sounds like a dismissive answer, but it's not. You may be looking for a magic trick that doesn't exist. Being able to rip out a blazing mandolin lead part takes years of work and intimacy with the mandolin fretboard.

There's only one way to get there. Practice, practice, practice. Work on as many fiddle tunes as you can until you're so familiar with the usual keys that you don't even have to think about it. Work on up-the-neck closed-position scales and arpeggios. Work on tremolo and cross-picking. These things all come together over time and you'll find yourself getting smoother and faster. But it takes a long time to play like the pros do.

[festus01]

thank y'all so much for the advice and help. i am practicing diligently and i had about decided that it was a matter of becoming intimate with the fretboard and notes. i guess i was hoping for some kind of magic that doesn't exist. lol. i do truly appreciate you taking time to help.
festus01

[Steve Sorensen]

Try to copy what John Duffy did.

[stevedenver]

Try to copy what John Duffy did.

1 I agree, use those note 'boxes' in the link, find the root note in each, ie if you're in G find the G note, etc-why? it will help you know where you are and a good note on which to start and end.

This is imho, critical-you can play a G scale over all the chords in a song in the key of G, more or less; later you can follow the changes, ie play a C when the G moves to a C chord, etc.

KNOW the CHORD CHANGES OF YOUR SONGS in addition to knowing the melody.


2 best and most effective, time investment-wise and brain damage wise-truly, imho, learn the melody, even if simplified, and use it in/as your solo-why?
because the listener gets it, you add to the overall, you know where you are, and so does the band,

and, the BEST part, once you know the melody dead cold, you are superbly equipped to massage it and stray away and then return-ie truly improvise using the melody as the skeleton for your creativity.

3 in a pinch, arppegiate the chord you are 'on'. Use those boxes to help find additional notes that sound good !

4 lose your butterflies and simply have some abandon and fun, don't worry about mistakes-it isn't screwing up, its failing to get back into the song.

and, something that will help you develop auto pilot, is to practice scales,
but, play them this way, using the numbers below as the note order in the scale, ie you play them in ascending and descending 'thirds'.


1,3,2,4,3,5,4,6,5,7,6,8-SLOWLY AT FIRST
in doing this, you also will change strings as you would normally.

you may recognize this as a common piano exercise once you hear it-do this going up the scale and descending-do this daily, several times, start with open G-it WILL provide muscle memory on how to play notes in the scale, out of order-this you CAN do, if you like, watching TV after a while-

another thing to do, is to play the G scale, but , once you get to the 5th fret on the D string, shift your entire hand to continue the scale, using the fifth position -this will help you learn to shift on the fly-it is essentially target practice and with practice, you WILL be able to do it accurately at speed.

4 find a backing track and only play it start to end, and learn to play the melody, and how to find your place when you flub-ie being able to re-enter-absolutely the essence imho, of playing on the fly-it will help you listen while you think 'now where was I and where am I supposed to be?" I cannot stress how important this is-it helps you learn the phrases of a tune, not simply learning it as one long piece-its a different method for the brain.

next step, do all this in A and closed fingering -then you're set for any key.

finally, know where to move in relation to your root chord: ie
if I play 0023, I know my IV is 5230, ie over one set of string, and I know my V is 745x. see how this makes and "L" shape?

if I play my G at the tenth fret position (12, 9,10,X) then I know my C is "over" and "down" (down in the sense of the musical scale, ie toward the nut) two frets using the first string position, ie X,10,7,9), and I know my D is the 'same as my G , simply moved over to the top three strings, ie , X,12, 9, 10-

[jaycat]

. . . what is the best approach to learn to do lead breaks the fastest so that I can do my part in our band. I just want to do a good job and take some leads since we are representing GODS word and ministry. thanks for any and all advice.

It's OK with God if you don't play fast. I asked Her.

[Sven the Impaler]

Try putting on a appropriate Pandora station....and play along. That's how I learned guitar years ago (although then it was to Neil Young's Harvest).

Sven

[Mark Wilson]

The only quick way to soloing that I've heard about involves hanging out at the crossroads round midnight. Bring your soul.

[LongBlackVeil]

thank y'all so much for the advice and help. i am practicing diligently and i had about decided that it was a matter of becoming intimate with the fretboard and notes. i guess i was hoping for some kind of magic that doesn't exist. lol. i do truly appreciate you taking time to help.
festus01

For me, the ffcp notes are magic. You just have to get familiar with them. Listen to your favorite BG mandolinist, try to copy him/her. It becomes a lot easier when you use these positions because most of the notes they use will be there somewhere in these boxes.

It also of course helps you to create your own licks

[festus01]

stevedenver thank you so much for taking the time to help me, i truly appreciate your advice and i will do as you have suggested, thanks again brother.

[High Lonesome Valley]

It's OK with God if you don't play fast. I asked Her.

Thanks, jaycat. Your originality is only exceeded by your hebetation.

Festus01, a great way to learn leads is to isolate a specific riff from your favorite player. Listen repeatedly to a specific short portion of a CD or sound clip, learn it note for note, and incorporate it into your lead playing.

[fatt-dad]

Learn how to whistle. Whistle along with music. Learn to play what you whistle.

Sing the mandolin!

f-d

[JeffD]

I understand what you are wanting, and the practical advice given is right on. IMO.

My take is that we bring our personal best to worship music. Not perfection, but our personal best effort to do the music with appropriate reverence and effective transmission of the message, and remembering it is not how good we do on our own, but that the music points to glory. That can be done at every level of skill and experience.

[Alex Orr]

Has no one mentioned learning your major pentatonic scale patterns? Really? You can "fake" a decent break to most any BG song using pentatonics.

[mandroid]

Absorb the melody of the song into your head .. play that melody .
regurgitate what you digested for the break .

It's a Church.. what can they punish you with, if you are not perfect.

[stevedenver]

Has no one mentioned learning your major pentatonic scale patterns? Really? You can "fake" a decent break to most any BG song using pentatonics.

dead right

for a nice bluesy G scale,
try , on the a string frets 1, 3,4,5
and on the e string, 1 and 3, and 6

the root is 3 on the E string

that oughta help-
but, imho, sometimes the pentatonic sometimes doesn't work with the mood of some songs, such as ill fly away, bury me beneath the willow, etc-


so you play practice those scales, and find the flatted 3 and 7 -your good!

and there is great info at jazzmando.com

but,
improv is overwhelming at first,
like trying to read without knowing the alphabet

in keeping it simple, formulaic at first, imho

no overload,

small bites, one at a time
and ones that can be easily remembered, and then he can add to the stash of tricks!

[UsuallyPickin]

Learn the chord structure. Learn the melody. For a solo play the first line of the melody ending in a double stop tremolo. Play the second lines chord structure with a dominant 7th arpeggio lick, don't be afraid of repeating tones or going to a second octave. Play the third line as a return to the melody. Play the fourth line with a flashy blues scale lick ending with a slide into the closing tone ....... double stops can be sprinkled using the chord tones liberally throughout......... luck.... R/

[farmerjones]

I dunno. Let's say you're in a jam, and the goal is to learn the tune before it ends. Then playing the chord progression would maybe pass as a survival tactic. But if you have the time to learn the melody, I think it shows you've paid homage to the composer. Sure 90% of the audience doesn't know any difference, but you'll know.

[Mark Wilson]

Play the second lines chord structure with a dominant 7th arpeggio lick, don't be afraid of repeating tones or going to a second octave.

UsuallyPickin, can you recommend an example of this? I've heard "dominant 7th arpeggios" as done by electric guitar players (usually shredders?) but can't relate that style to mandolin. Thanks

[Pete Jenner]

It's a Church.. what can they punish you with, if you are not perfect.

Do they still do lightening bolts? ..or crucifiction perhaps?

[Ky Slim]

I just want to do a good job and take some leads since we are representing GODS word and ministry.

You are already doing a Great job!!! Thank You!


I think that stevedenver and Jeff D nailed it with their comments.

I'll Fly Away picks out really well on the mando and can get you going. http://www.traditionalmusic.co.uk/ma...l_Fly_Away.htm

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Learn how to whistle. Whistle along with music. Learn to play what you whistle.

Sing the mandolin!

f-d

"If you want to play the Minuet in G, think the Minuet in G."

[terzinator]

Melody. Pick out a melody, and hear it in your head, and try to play it.

Stevedenver mentioned "formulaic" and I think there's truth to that. Originality is wonderful, but I think the most original players understand that there's a certain amount of discipline and fundamental understanding that comes from learning the formulas/scales/patterns that we all know as "familiar."

A few deviations from "standard" and things get pretty crazy! You don't have to go too far.

But like you said, there's no "magic bullet" but it's magic when things come together.

Practice like the devil, Doc Watson used to say.