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Jeffers
Feb-01-2005, 8:49am
Wondered if anyone else gets this:

Most days I pick up my mandolin and it sounds great - clear as a bell, great tone and volume etc. #Some days though, it just doesn't sound so good. #The sound comes out sort of tinny and it's really hard to tune, as if the notes just aren't pure.

I play a Godin A8 and am usually really happy with it. #Strings are month old D'addarios so they should be fine. #I was wondering if it was fret wear but I don't think there's enough of that to be the cause and most of the time as I say it sounds fine. #Maybe it's due to dirty strings? #I try to keep them clean with "fast fret" but do forget to do this regularly. #Wondered if maybe it was down to temperature or humidity or something. #Hmmm ... #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

I guess what I'm describing is the mandolin equivalent of a bad hair day or getting out of the wrong side of the case. #You know you're not firing on all cylinders but you just can't seem to work out why. #I'm pretty sure I'm not imagining it and wondered if anyone else finds this. #Do you just have to put up with it or are there any remedies?

Scotti Adams
Feb-01-2005, 9:00am
What you speak of happens with me too....some days are better than others...I truly believe that instruments go to sleep....some days they are harder coming awake then others. Things like temp. humidity and enviroment figure into this also.

fatt-dad
Feb-01-2005, 9:14am
On the flip side - the good days make me think I really know what I'm doing - ha.

f-d

Geno
Feb-01-2005, 10:44am
I find that this happens sometimes even when the temp and humidity are constant. I store all 3 mandolins (two Gibsons and a KM1000)in the same room, which I monitor closely. Some days one of them seems to sound a bit dead sounding, or at least less lively. Then, without changing strings or anything else, the same mandolin sounds significantly better in a day or two, and another one might be a bit off. Some days they all sound great! I've wondered, is it me or are these things just moody.

Pete Martin
Feb-01-2005, 11:37am
I believe that changes in weather affect the way sound waves travel through the air and this has something to do with the sound changes. #I can set up my recording stuff exactly the same, placement, mics, etc and things can sound VERY different day to day.

I know a lot of it is me, but there is something else as well. #Temperature? #Humidity? #Amount of dust in the air? #Any scientific types care to answer this?

Flowerpot
Feb-01-2005, 11:43am
It happens. Especially if the mandolin is still fairly young. Sometimes if it's having a bad day, you gotta play it really loud and hard to get it through the phase. Then it comes out sounding better the next day. Makes me wonder if they are like unruly children, who get cranky, finicky, and rebellious, and need a firm hand of discipline to set them right.

steve in tampa
Feb-01-2005, 11:50am
Barometric pressure. The top of the instrument vibrates moving air as acoustically amplified sound waves out of the f holes. If there are variences in the ambient air pressure, the instrument will behave/sound/play differently. Kind of like the air pressure in your car tires giving a hard ride when overinflated.

mandopete
Feb-01-2005, 11:56am
I know a lot of it is me, but there is something else as well. #Temperature? #Humidity? #Amount of dust in the air? #Any scientific types care to answer this?
I think it's probably the 'shine!

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

bmac
Feb-01-2005, 12:28pm
I read your comments with interest and am going to take a stab at a possible answer to the changing sounds of your mandolin(s).

I suspect that the problem may be anything from temperature to humidity, or just plain phisiological changes for whatever reasons. But the variation in tone is just as likely to be physical changes in your own body chemistry as it is changes in the mandolin.THe most dramatic changes I have experienced have been after quitting smoking When I began hearing things I hadn't heard before, when playing my mandolin or guitar. In my case the change in tone were dramatic and eventually my hearing (sensitivity) leveled off and I no longer notice such dramatic variation. But my thoughts are that the changes you hear are as likely to be caused by physiological changes in body function or chemistry as they are to be mandological.

When I first experienced these changes in sound I asked my wife if she could hear them and she could not. That is when I began to think it was my own sensitivity to sound which changed rather than in the xsound of my mandolin.

Scotti Adams
Feb-01-2005, 12:34pm
..yea....sometimes I think he are hearing things....or not.

jmkatcher
Feb-01-2005, 12:46pm
I've noticed the same thing on all of the mandolins I've owned. What's weird is that the guitars in the house are very consistent at the same time.

GBG
Feb-01-2005, 12:52pm
Anyone check the phases of the moon.

Darryl Wolfe
Feb-01-2005, 12:56pm
I posted some stuff about "people playing the sound out of an instrument" on a thread a week or two ago. I believe that the subject of this thread is very much related...generally speaking the instrument itself can and does get affected by numerous physically induced variables.
The temperature, humidy and barometric pressure variables mentioned here are simply more of those "things" that can "put a mandolin to sleep".

Conversely, there has to be things that have the exact opposite affect...such as a person with exceptional technique as it relates to sonic properties of the instrument...and ideal "weather conditions"

Rick Schmidlin
Feb-01-2005, 1:02pm
I own a Prucha F with a German Spruce top, it always sounds open.I also havea Roy Noble guitar with a Cedar top, same deal. Ad and Sitka tops take more to wake up and have a harder time with climate change.Engelman.German,Italian spruce open up quicker with weather change. Those great Italian violins are made with European spuce, softer and more britle, but they have lasted centurys.Cedar is cool but the clasical of years gone get dead with time. And time is still judgeing Cedar Mandolins and Guitars.If your mandolin is Sitka or Ad, play the hell out of it for twenty minutes and you will surprised that is sound as good as good has ever been.

Rick

Kevin K
Feb-01-2005, 1:17pm
I've expereienced the same thing too. Our group played at a Church Sunday night that was close to a creek, had been raining and the auditorium really seemed muggy. First the sound (we use a one mic setup) just didn't sound as good as normal so I did the best that I could. Then taking the mandolin out, it seemed very muffled as well. It sounded great when I left home. It never really opened up while there and just today it's back to sounding like it should. I sure would like to know more about keeping it in the idea sound range and what I could do to help that. The room that the instruments are in at home are kept at a 45% -50%humidty most of the time year round but I don't have much control of the environments the group goes to. Any suggestions or recommendations?

fatt-dad
Feb-01-2005, 1:27pm
So, is a 48-hour trial period enough? What if the moon, barometric pressure, temperature and relative humidity all gang up on an otherwise great mandolin? Then what?

f-d

J. Mark Lane
Feb-01-2005, 1:43pm
This has been happening with my little Morris F5 to a remarkable extent. At first, I was surprised by it. I would pick it up, and wow, it just seemed like a different instrument. It tends to have good days and bad days. I read somewhere that this is the first sign of a mandolin "opening up." I've always been slightly skeptical of such things, but I don't care what anyone says, I can hear it -- and it's not me, and it's not my "body chemistry" (does beer help?), and it's not "the weather" (instrument stays in constant conditions).

Mark

steve in tampa
Feb-01-2005, 2:00pm
There are several factors that all factor in to the overall sound. The instrument itself can be effected by the different humidity levels, and different woods with different finishes will react in different ways, ad nauseum.
I had an interesting experience with a relatively green mandolin coming in to better sound from being played in a high humidity situation around a smoky smoky (that's 2 smokies) campfire. It still sounds better than it did before that incident.
Without debating the actual source of the sound, and assuming a constant there, the environment that the sound waves would actually have to travel through to the listener can be a huge variable.
Compare throwing a pebble into a puddle of water vs. a puddle of motor oil. The waves are from the same source, but are travelling through a different environment, and are effected differently, though they are of the same origin and shape, one has met more resistance.

El Rey del Mando
Feb-01-2005, 2:03pm
I have a 96 Flatiron F5 artist Mt.made that acts like that.I play this one every day.Sometimes it acts funky when I light it up for the first time of the day.I just beat the devil out of it some, and as Rick said, it comes back in about 10 minnutes.A good blast of Rawhide or Lost Indian is all it takes.On the other hand,my Gibson is good all the time and I play it every day also. I keep all my instruments in the same room which stays about 50% humidity @ 68 degrees.I never could figure that Flatty out.

John

Moose
Feb-01-2005, 2:13pm
This is why one should have more then one mando ; no one here is crazy - never mind what non-pickers say!! - Instruments( i.e. wood instruments) - Will act in this manner - The thing to do when you "just can't get it right", is, put it DOWN - gently - go to another instrument(which will probably sound OK - to you!) - pick away! - Later - maybe hrs.... maybe next day!??## - go back. It does work. Actually repeating "bad/nasty" words and/or phrases sometimes help(be sure there are no children or "sensitive" folks near-by!#) - Well-made guitars & mandos are much like certain human species(ops!..) - Have more then one ; if it gets "tempermental" - put it down..., walk away - come back later.. - one is good.., TWO -or more - is better ; ya' know what I mean - EL Mooso "the-voice-of-experience". http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

fatt-dad
Feb-01-2005, 2:51pm
Not something else to obsess over. Do I need a journal for each mandolin? Would a spreadsheet help? Stop me!

p.s., to those with climate controlled collections - you can't control the barometric pressure, which may actually have an affect (I would think minescule) on the way sound moves through the air.

fatt the-curse-of-the-engineer dad

GBG
Feb-01-2005, 3:40pm
No moon on Feb.8 (Mardi Gras) and a full moon on Feb. 24. Compare mandolin sleeping habits on these two days and report findings. I thought you could control barometric pressure?

acousticphd
Feb-01-2005, 3:47pm
I've always been slightly skeptical of such things, but I don't care what anyone says, I can hear it

And I don't doubt your (collective) senses. I have noticed instruments "opening up" slowly over months, and going "flat" if left unused for awhile. Noticeable day-to-day differences *in the same setting*, not so much. But now that I have a new mandolin (another "little" Morris), we'll see. Differences in sound/responsiveness in different playing environments, ie, indoors vs outdoors, large vs small area, noisy vs quiet, facing the wall or not, would seem to be more external than caused by the instrument, wouldn't they?

J. Mark Lane
Feb-01-2005, 3:56pm
Yeah, I think so, Jeff. For whatever it's worth, I rarely leave my "little" studio. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif So the differences I am noticing are in the same controlled environment, sometimes literally minutes apart from each other. Like suddently the thing will just "ring," where a minute ago it sounded dead. It seems like the "ringing" is more frequent as time goes by, but I'm not sure yet whether that's my imagination. It's all very hard to tell.

A couple of times, I thought "maybe I'll sell this thing," then it seemed to "wake up." Maybe it's trying to tell me something.

Mark

El Rey del Mando
Feb-01-2005, 4:52pm
...I think I'm crazy,but when I get to read all these posts,I find that I MIGHT be completely normal....

John

Feb-01-2005, 5:03pm
Happens to me every once in a while. Actually yesterday it didn't sound how i wanted it too. I did just put a new set of J-74's on it so it was kind of hard to tune. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

El Rey del Mando
Feb-01-2005, 5:10pm
Well PGA,you know how thoes J74s are when you first put them on.It normaly takes mine 5 or 6 hours to start to sound good again.It makes me almost hate to change strings, just knowing whats going to happen.I like them after about a day.

John

Feb-01-2005, 7:25pm
Yep it gets me too. But not putting them on makes me even worse. Because those old strings start to sound worse and worse. I was just playing and there about up to normal now.

johnwalser
Feb-01-2005, 8:41pm
I noticed this strange behavior about a year ago. I kept a chart of barometric pressure and humidity for a couple of months trying to figure this problem out. I found NO pattern whatsoever. I then looked at it from the point of what my ear was hearing and decided, at least for me, the problem was my allergies. Days when I have ANY congestion, my ears stop up a bit and muffle the sound my instrument is making. Usually, I take a Clariton and within a few hours notice a bit of improvement. Days that I haven't any congestion at all, my mandolin sounds much improved.
John

bmac
Feb-02-2005, 12:32pm
john

your hearing experience was very similar to mine... As a smoker I apparently had an alergic reaction to nicotine which caused my hearing to distort. I became so used to it that when I quit smoking and the sound became clear... I didn't understand that what I was now hearing was the actual sound of the instrument undistorted by swelling in the ear canal.

addcourt
Feb-02-2005, 1:15pm
I've been experiencing the "off" sounding instrument syndrome for years and until reading these posts thought it was just me having an off day. When it happens, it does so with all my instruments(mandolins and banjos)even though they stay in the same environmentally controlled room. It generally doesn't ease up so I opt for a non-musical past-time until the problem clears up. Since it's consistent across the board with my instruments, I can assume that the problem is with me. It is comforting knowing that I'm not alone with this problem. Can't beat the rate for this group therapy! Regards.

Jeffers
Feb-03-2005, 7:43am
I second Mike. Nice to know I'm not alone! I guess next time the sleepy mando strikes, I'll try "whupin' it like a mule" for a while. If that still doesn't work I'll put it down and come back when it's a bit less moody.