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John Flynn
Jan-22-2005, 10:10am
There was a thread some time ago asking about the new Sony Hi-MD recroders and none of the responders had any hands-on experience with the new format. Also, there seems to be interest in general on the board in devices for recording mando music. I just got one of the new Hi-MDs and I though I would follow up on that previous thread.

I have been a minidisc user for some time. I use it to record jams, lessons, practices and performances, as well as using it for portable music listening. My big disappointment was that it would not enable you to upload the music to a PC or covert the files. I initially got an iRiver H320 for Christmas, with the idea that it would be an upgrade, but returned it because I found it very user-unfriendly. I work in the computer industry and I am not technophobic, but I think you have to be a real techno person to get the most out of it. I then ordered the Sony MZ-NH1, the top of the line of the new Hi-MD recorders. I also got the ECM-MS907 single point stereo microphone.

I like the unit and I will keep it. Here are my pros and cons:

Pros:
> The unit is very small and lightweight.
> The "remote control" unit takes some getting used to, but once you learn it is pretty logical and easy to operate.
> The sound quality is so good, it's spooky. Night and day from my old mini-disc and cheap mike. I recorded a lesson with Curtis Buckhannon in his living room. During the recording, a door closed in his house. When I played it back, not only was his playing as close to studio quality as I can imagine from such a unit, but the door noise from his house was so real that I pulled off my headset because I thought a door had closed in my house! I have done a lot of field recording and I have never had that happen before.
> For pre-recorded music, the 1GB disks hold 8 CDs easily in the highest quality recording mode. They say they will hold about 45 CDs in the lower mode. I did a side by side comparison of the modes on some music that had fiddles and female voices, traditionally the hardest to record. I had to really listen intently with a good headset to hear the difference. I decided to use the high quality mode, but for general "portable music" use the lower mode would be fine.
> You can upload the ATRAC-format field recordings to the PC and Sony now has a downloadble piece of software that allows you to convert them to WAV files that can be burned onto CDs, converted to MP3's for posting on the web, etc. It is an unfortunate extra step, but it works very well.
> The MZ-NH1 has a feature that allows you to slow down a field recording without changing the pitch, like "slow down" software does. It works pretty well. I found the slowed-down quality to be not quite as good as with slow down software, but acceptable.

Cons:
> You can't use house current to power the unit when it is plugged into the PC. The power adpator and the USB use the same slot and there is no phantom power option.
> You have to use the charger stand to charge. The older units would let you plug the adaptor right into the MD unit. So when I travel, I will have to lug the stand around.
> The system takes some time to get set up, with software loading, figuring out what all the controls do, etc. It is not as user friendly as the old mini-disc, but then it does have more functionality.
> The Sony help desk people are not helpful. They take thier own sweet time just to tell you company-line stuff like, "uninstall the software and re-install" and then it turns out that wasn't the problem. After three days with the unit, I now know more about the system than these guys do.
> The unit does not come with a case. I bought the optional Sony case, which is not that great. I recommend going to a camera store and finding a good padded case that carries what you want to carry.

peterbc
Jan-22-2005, 12:09pm
Thanks for the review, I've been really curious about these. I have an old MD that works alright, but having more space and especially being able to upload easily (or easier and quicker!) are big bonuses. Once I scrape up some more money I might have to get one...

Do you know the difference between the lower models and the higher ones? as far as specs go, they seem pretty similar (though I know some don't record).

Dolamon
Jan-22-2005, 12:13pm
Great over vue John. I asked the original question a month or so ago, in the interim, I got an MZ NH900 and am thrilled with it. This is one step below the NH1 but the differences (to me - at this time) were more academic than real issues for me. Primarily, I got this for practice and class sessions and it works, amazingly well.

This model uses an external battery pack (1 AA battery) in addition to the internal battery. So far, after three weeks of intermitent use, it hasn't had to be recharged or the battery replaced. That amazes me. As far as recording quality, you are absolutely correct. The differences between the highest and lowest quality can only be detected on a relatively good stereo at higher volume. To 'field record' I probably would use the middle settings (I can't hear the difference between the two) and get about three hours of recording on a 74mb or 80mb disc. This is a good feature. Relatively cheap, reusable media which seems to be as reliable as a stone. - and the included Sonic Software lets me download into four or five formats.

What this one CAN'T do is the slowdowner technique. But I have that feature on my computer so it's just one more step ...

A suggestion and a question - I got a small, well padded Targus case from Best Buys which holds the NH900, a spare battery or two and in a separate, padded zippered slot, three additional discs with the MS907 microphone and cable. Total cost - 4.95 and tax.

What I haven't been able to find is a source for the 1GB discs, any ideas? Thanks for posting your note - while not the least expensive way to have a field studio, the latitude and possibilities are staggering. I am still learning more of what it can do from the HUGE manual.

Onesound
Jan-22-2005, 1:36pm
Thanks for the interesting review, John. You obviously have a lot of experience with MD. Every once and I while, I read that MDs are dead. (Just heard that Sanyo, or someone else, has just dropped out of the market.) I hope MDs are around for a while, cause they do a super job of recoeding on the fly.

Maybe you can answer a question for me. I've got an older Sony MD that uses the 74min disks. A few months ago, I picked up a pack of 80 min disks (the only MDs that the store had available). Now, I discover that they will not play in my MD recorder. Get and "Error" message on my machine. Thought maybe I could erase or reformat but that doesn't seem to be an option. Guess I can't use them - correct? Anybody want to buy a 5 box of 80 min MDs cheap?

Cheers,
Brian

John Flynn
Jan-22-2005, 7:36pm
What I haven't been able to find is a source for the 1GB discs, any ideas?

www.minidisco.com

You can order them singly, but the also sell them in packs of 10 and you can save a few bucks.

Re: the 80 min disks not working

I have used both 74 min and 80 min. sucessfully in my old MD. It may not be the length, but the manufacturer. Are they Sony disks? A guy at Best Buy once told me that they were getting a lot of returns of a particular brand of mini-discs that just wouldn't work in the older players. I can't remember the brand, I just know it wasn't Sony.

In answer the questions about models and features, I am not an expert, but the minidisco site linked above has page with side-by-side comparisons, which is very helpful. I do know that only the unit I have has the slow down feature.

glauber
Jan-22-2005, 8:22pm
I then ordered the Sony MZ-NH1, the top of the line of the new Hi-MD recorders. I also got the ECM-MS907 single point stereo microphone.
[...]
> The sound quality is so good, it's spooky. Night and day from my old mini-disc and cheap mike. I recorded a lesson with Curtis Buckhannon in his living room. During the recording, a door closed in his house. When I played it back, not only was his playing as close to studio quality as I can imagine from such a unit, but the door noise from his house was so real that I pulled off my headset because I thought a door had closed in my house!
That's the microphone. I've had the exact same experience with my standard Sharp MD and the Sony 907 microphone. The 907 is not even a high-end microphone, but this kind of single-point-stereo microphone gives freakshly realistic stereo images.

delsbrother
Jan-23-2005, 2:07am
Where's the best place to get the players/mics? Online? Or places like Best Buy, etc. Worth it to get extended warranties? I'm looking for something to record extended jam sessions and convert the music to CD.

Thanks,

Darrell

Dolamon
Jan-23-2005, 6:51am
Darrell - there are at least two web sites which are devoted to these devices,
Mini disc. org (http://www.minidisc.org/) and #Mini Disco (http://www.minidisco.com/index.html). Both are definately worth exploring ... if only to understand what some of the terminology refers to.

At the first listing (org) they have a comparison listing on the bottom of the middle column which lists any dealers, I think on a world wide basis. The surprise for me was in calling one of the dealers (highest list price) and getting a better retail price than anything offered on the site. As for the 907 microphone ... I found a clearance at eBay which was one third the list price.

Hope this helps -

Oh yes, the 80mb discs are available at Walmart or Best Buys. As for regular walk in store retail ... the iPod and similar devices have taken over the subportable market for the general consumer. The MiniDiscs (recorders) are now considered professional / semiprofessional field recording devices and virtually, only Sony remains as a maker. Which is both good and bad ...

delsbrother
Jan-23-2005, 7:46am
Dolamon, when I go to that site it says the unit you have DOES have the pitch controller.. Who's tellin' the truth? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

The unit one step below yours has a radio tuner in it (and no pitch control) - do you know if you can record radio to MD with this? That might be the one for me, as I've often wished I could record sports events but could never find media big enough to hold the whole recording. There are a bunch other differences between this unit and yours - not exactly sure if they would negatively affect jam recording quality. When you were shopping for yours did you (or anyone else) look at this model?

Darrell

John Flynn
Jan-23-2005, 9:06am
I looked in the MZ-NH900 (the unit Dolamon has) owner's manual, which is online at Minidisco. It seems his unit does have a "slow downer" feature. Re-looking at the features of that unit, I think I might have chosen that one over the one I bought if I had it to do over again. It also has longer battery life and the options to use external batteries. That is good stuff.

I also looked at the manual for the MZ-NHF800, the one with the radio. There is good news and bad news. It seems any of these MD units, not just this one, can do analog recording of radio or TV audio through the line in jack. They even show you how to do it in the manual. However, my quick search of the manual seems to indicate that you cannot record directly from the radio reciever built into the unit. That seems stupid, but it also seems like Sony. They seem to have an obsession over thier paranoid perception of copyright issues. It's like they don't actually care if you make copies of stuff, they just want to be able say they didn't give you functionality that made it easy for you to do it. It's "electronics design by lawyers."

hotclub
Jan-23-2005, 9:28am
Hi, I have a NH1 also and really like it, however the lack of being able to use an external battery is a bummer, so I thought it'd be a good idea to get a spare. It's only the size of a half piece of chewing gum but they're nearly $70! So nevermind. But FYI when it's plugged into the computer via the usb port, it's getting it's power from there also, so you don't have to worry about your battery giving out during a transfer. Using it to record my gigs has been invaluable for showing me what works and what needs work.

Dolamon
Jan-23-2005, 11:10pm
Ooooops - as I mentioned before ... the NH 900 has a huge manual and, rather than reading it front to back, I went to the parts I needed first. I guess I missed that section. Back to the books.

The only issue I have is partly due to my advancing eyesight, I have a little problem reading / seeing the small icons on the face screen and remembering how to get some things to function on the 'jog wheel'. Thankfully the 900 has that nifty head set, back lit bump-in-the-cord which is easier to read but - just as easy to get lost in. I just plain missed the section on the slow downer and will be experimenting with that - ASAP.

Thanks for pointing out something I had but didn't realize.

Duh ...

delsbrother
Jan-24-2005, 12:14am
Thanks all - looks like the NH900 for me.