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View Full Version : Tailpiece & Mandolin Intonation Question.



levin4now
Jan-18-2005, 9:05am
I was wondering: When some of you have installed new tailpieces, does the bridge have to be moved to maintain correct intonation? For example, the Allen tailpiece appears "longer" than a standard "Gibson-style" and the Weber cast tailpiece appears the shortest (that is, the strings hook on right at the base of the instrument).

Or does this not matter? Is it only the relation of the nut, 12th fret, and bridge? Does the tailpiece not matter?

I've not replaced a tailpiece before and wondered if that affected it.

Lane Pryce
Jan-18-2005, 9:11am
I would think that changing the after-length of the strings would indeed change the intonation. After-length is important with fiddles and I see the same relationship with mandolins. Try it and see. Lp http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

Tiderider
Jan-18-2005, 9:19am
The bridge determines intonation.

Lee

sunburst
Jan-18-2005, 9:33am
The after-length, or swing length as I've heard it called, does not change intonation.
It is important to have the correct swing length on violins, but it is for control of overtones with the bowed notes, not for intonation.
If the string length (nut to saddle) is correct for the fret scale, and the frets are accurate, the intonation will be good regardless of the length or position of the tailpiece.

Lane Pryce
Jan-18-2005, 3:27pm
There you go!! And learn something everyday :laugh:Lp

jukers
Nov-03-2013, 8:54pm
The after-length, or swing length as I've heard it called, does not change intonation.
It is important to have the correct swing length on violins, but it is for control of overtones with the bowed notes, not for intonation.
If the string length (nut to saddle) is correct for the fret scale, and the frets are accurate, the intonation will be good regardless of the length or position of the tailpiece.

So the best set up for a violin, viola, cello, or upright bass, the "swing" length (minus the tailpiece if i'm not mistaken) should be exactly 1/6th of the string length. If you were to touch your finger at the 1/6th length of the string itself you would result in a tone 2 ocatves above the open string, which should be the exact same as the "swing" pitch. So if the bridge were in the slightly wrong spot, then you get "wolf tones" since the overtones of the played conflict with the "swing" pitch.

I personally have never seen a mandolin with a proper tailpiece to intonate the "swing" notes, but reading this thread makes me want to make one just to see how much difference it makes. As an upright player foremost, it makes a HUGE difference when you actually get it right. On the bass I don't have frets, so adjustment of the bridge won't mess with my intonation, just the space between my fingers.

Its crazy the things you pickup in life....

Mandobart
Nov-03-2013, 10:44pm
So how do you keep the bridge in place while changing a tailpiece?

jukers
Nov-03-2013, 11:25pm
So how do you keep the bridge in place while changing a tailpiece?

You don't. You re-intonate... or at least that's what I do.

kkmm
Nov-05-2013, 4:17pm
Changing the tail plece requites removing the strings and the bridge therefore will fall off.
This require re-positionning the bridge again for good intonation, unless you mark its previous position then it's easier to put it exactly at the same old spot.

Folkmusician.com
Nov-06-2013, 12:20am
Use a low tack masking tape to mark the location of the bridge. If the bridge is placed exactly in the taped off spot, the intonation will be the same.. Do check it though, as bridges have a tendency to migrate over time and there is always room for improving the intonation. :)

Bob Buckingham
Nov-12-2013, 8:20am
I have seen bridges on cheaper mandolins that migrated. Usually they went south.

Killian King
Nov-12-2013, 10:23am
Does intonation affect the tuning capability of the mandolin in any way? I am not talking about a large difference here.

Thanks

MikeEdgerton
Nov-12-2013, 11:01am
I have no problem setting my bridge back but for those that might there is a simple answer. Don't take all the strings off at the same time. Remove a set, replace a set.

If the intonation is off you will be able to tune the open strings just fine. You will however find that as you check the notes up the neck some may be out of tune.