strings on Vega cylinderback

[atetone]

I soon have to have a new nut and bridge made and fitted on my Vega cylinderback. I am trying out different strings so I can have the nut and bridge slotted for the exact string guage that I intend to use.
I want to get this mando set up right this time.
The problem is that I am not sure which strings to go with.
What strings are you using on your cylinderback and what has your experience been with stringing these mandolins?
All opinions appreciated.

[PlayerOf8]

Dogals are the only way to go. They are available from Classic Bows in San Diego, CA.


G

[Mando Medic]

GHS makes a very light set for classical and Thomastic Infield has a light guage that I would suggest too. Kenc

[atetone]

I just put a set of the TI lightest guage on it a few days ago replacing a set of Martin lights.
I changed them by taking one G string off and putting one TI G string on and then comparing tones. I repeated this for all of the courses.
To my suprise I found that the Martins even though they had been on the mandolin for quite a while sounded better than the TIs. Now I understand that the TIs have a break in period so I am not sure how that would have played out because I got impatient and replaced the remaining Martins. Maybe I should have left them on for a week or so to do a real comparison.
The TIs now sound good but leave a question in my mind about wether or not they are better sounding than the Martins.
The TIs definately are slick and nice to play and will probably last a lot longer, but to me right now it is about getting the best sound and getting the nut and bridge cut for the proper strings.
I am confused and would appreciate some more opinions from others' experiences. Help a brother out?

[Bob DeVellis]

I've been very happy with Martin Lights on my cylinder-back mando.

[Bob A]

I'd recommend never using anything heavier than the light-gauge bowlback-suitable strings, like GHS Classicals or the other strings mentioned above. I had occasion to sell a cylinder-back on consignment. The prospective purchaser removed the Dogal lights I had on the instrument and put on a set of bluegrass-type strings. Needless to say, the neck warped, the guy sent the mandolin back to the consigning dealer, and the whole thing was disappointing in a big way.

These thin-topped instruments are nothing more than bowlbacks by another name. I include flatbacks by Martin and the Larson brothers, and others of that type, as well. You will destroy them stringing them with sets made for the much heavier Gibson-style instruments.

[Jim Garber]

I believe that the Milwaukee mandolin Orchestra whihc has quite a few Vega cylinders in it, uses Thomastiks exclusively. I would say that the recommendation to light strings would be appropriate.

Jim

[Eugene]

I just put a set of the TI lightest guage on it a few days ago replacing a set of Martin lights.
I changed them by taking one G string off and putting one TI G string on and then comparing tones. I repeated this for all of the courses.
To my suprise I found that the Martins even though they had been on the mandolin for quite a while sounded better than the TIs. Now I understand that the TIs have a break in period so I am not sure how that would have played out because I got impatient and replaced the remaining Martins. Maybe I should have left them on for a week or so to do a real comparison.
The TIs now sound good but leave a question in my mind about wether or not they are better sounding than the Martins.
The TIs definately are slick and nice to play and will probably last a lot longer, but to me right now it is about getting the best sound and getting the nut and bridge cut for the proper strings.
I am confused and would appreciate some more opinions from others' experiences. Help a brother out?
I don't have a cylinderback, but I have a good number of canted top mandolins that are similar enough. Thomastik makes good flat-wound strings, but liking their sound isn't necessarily a matter of "good" or "better," but of personal taste. I am simply not too found of the flat-wound sound. It is "thumpy" and direct, but lacks a bright trebly edge; some people don't like the bright, trebly edge, so Thomastik suits them well. As George mentions, I prefer the sound of Dogal's "Calace" carbon steel after it's broken in, and that grade of steel is very long lived, much longer than any GHS strings I've used.

[Dave Caulkins]

This thread is making me a wee bit nervous...

I sent my new Vega mando off to a local luthier for a set-up, new saddle, and some 'clean up' type jobs. I'm kinda fussy about strings, and I do love those Calaces, but Maple Leaf in Brattleboro had a poor selection of really light strings. Since I was having the saddle reconstructed for my preference, I decided that I'd try out TIs. The problem? All they had were Mittels! I'm getting a bit nervous about my decision to go with 'so heavy' a gauge. Are they too much even though they are equivelent to lights from most companies?

Argh, I'm starting to panic!

Dave

[atetone]

Leshii, I am hesitant to say this but I put a set of Mittels on my Vega a few weeks ago and then took them off right away. I thought they were too heavy.
Now,, I have to say that I am no expert on these things so it is possible that they were just fine, but compared to the Martin lights that I took off the mando the Mittels seemed fairly hefty so I took them off and put them on my old 1915 Gibson A.
I could be completely wrong in my assumtions here also. I don't claim to really know, just had a feeling that they were too heavy for my liking.

[MANDOLINMYSTER]

Interesting thread, I have been using the TI lights for a while on my Vega 205, but the tone is a little "dull" they feel great though. But I would like to try the Dogal's Calace, can anyone recomend a source http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Jim Garber]

But I would like to try the Dogal's Calace, can anyone recomend a source http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
The only source in the US for Dogal mandolin strings is:
Classic Bows, Inc., PO Box 81655, San Diego, CA 92138
Phone: 1-888-402-5277
email: classicbows@nethere.com
Talk to Greg Gohde who specializes in mandolins

For info (http://www.dogalstrings.it/pages/mandolino.htm) and technical data (http://www.dogalstrings.it/pages/mandolin_tab.htm).

RW92B Soft Tension (dolce)
RW92 Regular Tension (medio)

Jim

[atetone]

Is there any info available for the Dogal Calace re: string guages and tensions?
I would just like to get some idea of just how light the lights are compared to other brands that I am familiar with.

[Jim Garber]

Is there any info available for the Dogal Calace re: string guages and tensions?
I would just like to get some idea of just how light the lights are compared to other brands that I am familiar with.
I would contact Greg Gohde at the link above. You can try Dogal directly. I think I have gotten a reply in the past from email.

The RW92b works quite well with the fragile vintage bowlbacks. They are lighter than the D;Addario J62s tho I am not sure of the absolute gauge. There is no specific gauge info on the packaging.

Jim

[Bob DeVellis]

If you look at the packaging for Martin LIghts, you'll see a Martin Style A on the cover. If you've ever asked Martin for string recommendations, you've probably noticed that they're pretty conservative. When I asked them about putting heavier gauge strings tuned to a lower pitch on a '45 tenor guitar I wanted to tune an octave below a mandolin, they said never use anything but extra-light tenor strings. I mentioned that the total tension of the strings I had in mind was less than the extra-light tenor set tuned to C and they still said they couldn't endorse anything but the extra-light tenors. In contrast, I spoke to a Martin repair person about suitable strings for a 1919 Martin flatback that I bought from him. He assured me that the Martin Lights were fine and were what he used routinely.

I've also used them on my Vega 202 with no problem. The neck joint on a Vega, while not nearly as robust as a dovetail, is quite different from typical bowlback construction. A bowlback has a heel-less neck and no neck block other than the somewhat enlarged end of the neck itself. The Vega has a neck with a heel and one of the largest neck blocks of any mandolin, extending below the shoulder points on either side. However, the joint is a tapered mortice and tenon which isn't as secure as a dovetail. If the neck has come loose, then all bets are off; but if it's solid, it should be capable of a greater load than a bowl back neck. While I wouldn't dream of putting bluegrass-weight strings (e.g., .011 - .040 and above) on a Vega cylinder-back, the Martin lights, which run from .010 to .034, don't seem to pose a problem. Of course, everyone has to do what fits into their comfort zone and what sounds and feels good to them. Martin lights may feel like re-bar to those accustomed to classical strings.

One clue to overstringing is that the intonation can't be made right no matter where you place the bridge. Get it right in one place on the neck and it's off somewhere else. My Vega has excellent intomation accuracy with Martin lights, which suggests to me that whatever it was originally designed for may not have been that far off.

The other options mentioned, of course, can only be safer than the somewhat heavier Martins. So, if their sound and feel suit you, there's no reason on earth to go to the Martins. But I really like their tone on the Vega. They also feel pleasantly light under the left hand on that scale, easily used for hammers and pull-offs. Because I've been so pleased with them, I thought I'd respectfully offer an alternative to the prevailing point of view. If my instruments ever develop problems that suggest I'm flat-out wrong in my sanguinity with the Martins, rest assured that I'll be the first to admit my error and share my information with this group.

[mando_maven]

My 1914 Vega Cylinderback is very happy with Elixir Lights
(.010 - .034). This is my main instrument & gets lots of gig time in a variety of indoor and outdoor atmospheres. They last reasonably long and sound great. I play mostly classical, Celtic & Brazilian music. Don't know how blue grassers would like them.

[atetone]

I think that i'm going to order a set of the Dogals and give them a try.
The TI's just don't seem to be suited to this mandolin. The Martin lights were much better. Way more bounce and ring.
Next I'll compare the Dogals to the Martins and see how that works out. Now all I have to do is get around to ordering the Dogals. Thanks for the advice.

[Bob A]

Be advised that the Dogal strings have a pretty rough winding. It is difficult to execute a smooth slide on them.

A group of folks in the classical section got together and ordered some Lenzner strings from Europe. They're bronze-wound, and polished, unlike the Dogals. A shop in Pennsylvania, Acoustic Music Company, imported a bunch of sets; they may still have some, if you're interested.

[atetone]

Thanks Bob, I will look into that over in the classical section.
I hope they don't catch me snooping around over there. I suspect that some of those folks can actually play a mandolin.
If I get caught and forced to supply a sound clip then the jig's up. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Bob DeVellis]

I have Lenzners on my Martin bowlback and my Howe-Orme mandolin. I like them. They have more of a "classical" bright sound than the Martin lights. I actually prefer the latter on my Vega, but the Lenzners are nice strings, too.

[Dave Caulkins]

I've decided to stick with the 'Mittels' on my Cylinderback (wow! what a great instrument now that its set up!!!).They really don't feel too heavy at all, and they have a great tone. I actually don't think I could handle anything lighter, because they feel like air under my fingers with the low action. I'm so used to using 11s or higher on all my instruments, even electric guitar.

Dave

[atetone]

Leshii, glad to hear that they worked out for you.