The Mandolin Cafe Pick Tour

[mandopete]

The last communication I had was from Teri LaMarco on March 11th. Since that time it was headed to Daryl Thompson and that's the last I've heard.

[OdnamNool]

Uh...hello! Pick snitch! send 'em on!

[strumNgrin]

Dear Café members,
I have completed my evaluation of the picks on the tour and they are on their way to the next person on the list. I sincerely apologize for how long it took me to do this. My work was an attempt to add a little science to the evaluation process, and it just took longer than I expected. I hope the data derived are useful to some of you. I know that I have changed the pick I use now as a result of this evaluation.

How pleasing the sound is that is produced by the combination of four factors (instrument, strings, pick, and technique) is rather subjective and a matter of taste. Two
things that CAN be quantified, however, are:
1. The spurious noise produced by a given pick.
2. The level of harmonics (overtones) produced#which contribute to the depth, color and richness of the sound.

The method I used to do this evaluation was first, to construct a cradle for my mandolin (a Weber Fern) and remove one of the G strings and one of the E strings. The cradle was designed to be tipped into #two positions, one that allowed my picking machine (described below) to pluck the single G string (a wound string) and the other position to pluck the E string (a single strand string). This allowed testing of both types of strings and different frequency ranges.

The picking machine I made was a wood disc 12 inches in diameter, which matched the picking stroke of a human hand/wrist/arm. Fixed to the disc was a pick clamp which held the pick in latex rubber jaws to allow it to flex a bit as it would in one’s thumb/index finger grip. The disc was mounted on a shaft and rotated at 30 RPM by an electric
motor and gear box. This means the string was plucked once every 2 seconds.

A high quality studio mic was placed 24 inches from the front of the mandolin and the output fed through a linear preamp to a 31 channel graphic equalizer. It was also fed simultaneously to a spectrum analyzer. The graphic equalizer was “tuned” to drop out the primary frequency as well as the first through the fourth overtones with the
remaining output applied across a load and the power (voltage and current) measured there. This measurement then represented the total of non-contributing sound (noise) produced by each pick (clicks, rubs, twangs, etc.). Obviously, the higher the power measured in this way, the noisier the pick.

The second measurement was the combined voltage output in millivolts of the root plus first, second, third and fourth harmonics as measured on the spectrum analyzer. Here the numbers indicated the “punch” of each pick and its ability to produce the overtones so necessary to a quality sound. The higher the number, the better the result.

Obviously, this is a very limited study. No attempt was made to quantify other factors like pick feel, tremolo friendliness, and many other things which also matter as to whether you like the pick or don’t.

If any of you have additional questions, I would be happy to field them. Email me at daryl@strumNgrin.com. Thank you all for your patience and happy pickin’.

Respectfully,
Daryl J. Thompson


Pick# /Description /Contributor /Noise rating #/Tonal output
1 /Tri-corner mystery pick /Mandopete #/#2.1 #/ 7.2
2 /Golden gate shaped mystery pick#Mandopete /#1.4 / 6.0
3 /Unknown animal horn /#Elenbrandt /1.2 / 9.7
4 /GoldenGate/Elenbrandt /2.0 #/ 7.1
5 /Dawg /Mandodude /1.0 / 9.9
6 /David Grisman / Imapickin /3.2 / 8.9
7 /D’Andrea Tricornercorner 1.5mm /#Mandoplayer /1.9 /10.2
8 /Pygmy goat horn /#Jaybee /1.1 /4.2
9 /Medium teardrop ivory /#Dvatchka /9.8 /2.4
10 /Pygmy goat horn /Jaybee / 1.1 #/ 5.0
11 /Large teardrop ivory / Janjan /7.1 / 5.7
12 /Petite shape ivory (note 1) /Dvatchka /1.9 / 9.0
13 /Fender pearloid teardrop / Mandohack /#3.0 / 4.5
14 /Dunlop tortex H3 /Mandohack /1.9 / 4.2
15 /Dunlop big stubby clear /Mandohack /2.9 / 4.4
16 /Fender pearloid heavy #/ Mandohack /3.0 /7.2
17 /Dunlop gater grip 0.96mm /Mandohack /5.0 /5.0
18 /John Pearse /Mandohack /6.1 /3.9
19 /Dunlop ultex 1.0mm /Mandodude /2.0 /10.1
20 /Dunlop ultex 1.14mm /Mandohack /0.9 /11.0
21 /Clayton 0.8mm /Mandohack /5.2 /6.0
22 /Dunlop tortex 1.0mm / Landgrass /2.3 /8.1
23 /D’andrea brite 0.73 /Jim Pemantell /6.0 /4.9
24 /Martin H 0.96mm #/Mandohack /2.9 / 6.4
25 /Fender teardrop heavy /Mandodude /#2.3 / 5.3
26 /Hix medium /Jaybee /3.7 / 4.4
27 /Clayton teardrop with grip 0.8mm /8ch(pl) /2.9 / 2.1
28 /Dunlop gatergrip / Fishdawg40 /1.7 /7.9
29 /Purloined from McCabes /Elenbrandt /2.2 /5.0
30 /Gryphon /Elenbrandt /1.9 / 8.3
31 /Artichoke music /Mandolinplayer / 1.8 / 7.9
32 /Bananas at large /Elenbrandt /6.3 / 3.9
33 /Martha Stewart /Joshro78 /7.1 /3.9
34 /Homestead pickin’ parlor / Joe F /6.2 /4.0
35 /Missing
36 /Fender heavy teardrop /Grant Eversoll /1.9 /5.5
37 /Dunlop stubby 2.0mm /Grant Eversoll /1.1 /3.0
38 /Planet waves /Rick Gaskin /1.0 /8.0
39 /Cool heavy /Wolfsong /2.9 /5.5
40 /Roswell pick#/Wolfsong /5.1 /4.9
41 /Clayton 0.5mm /Wolfsong /9.0 /3.2
42 /Green ? /Wolfsong /2.9 /10.2
43 /Peavy H(modified teardrop) /Wolfsong /4.0 /6.1
44 /D’Andrea progrip brites 0.88 /Wolfsong #/5.3 /5.2
45 /Dunlop 208 /Wolfsong /0.9 /11.0
46 /Peavy H teardrop /Wolfsong /3.0 /6.0
47 /Fender heavy /Wolfsong /3.1 /8.4
48 /Galli S heavy 1.2mm /Keith Newell /3.8 / 8.1
49 /Dunlop 208 (cut down thinner) /Keith Newell /2.0 /8.8
50 /Dunlop triangle lg stubby 3.0mm / Keith Newell /4.2 /9.1
51 /D’Andrea progrip 1.0mm /Keith Newell /#5.2 / 5.1
52 /Dunlop nylon 1.0mm /#Keith Newell /#3.9 /5.4
53 /Clayton ultem 1.07mm /Mandomood /1.8 /9.3
54 /Animal horn Dugain knockoff /John Ely /5.3 /7.0
55 /Le Nose Pick ivory 1.45mm #/Bratche /4.9 /8.0
56 /Clayton delrin XL 1.14mm /Old wave gal / 2.2 /7.0
57 /Clayton delrin lg triangle 1.14mm/Old wave gal/2.1/7.0
58 /Dunlop nylon 0.88 (modified) /StrumNgrin /#2.0 / 6.1
59 /PAF-heavy F-1 (right handed) /StrumNgrin /6.2 /5.9
60 /Funky animal horn /Christina /3.1 /5.0
61 /Wood /#Christina #/7.0 /4.9
62 /Weird shaped Dunlop tortex 0.73mm /Tracy Mazar/2.8 / 8.2
63 /Dunlop stubby clear 1.0mm /Tracy Mazar /3.4 /4.9
64 /Dunlop stubby 3.0mm /Tracy Mazar /2.1 /5.9
65 /Tortex sharp 1.5mm /Tig /1.0 /8.5
66 /Clayton 1.52mm /Tig #/1.9 /7.4
67 /Clayton 1.9mm #/Rick Volante /1.1 /9.0
68 /Dunlop tortex 0.88mm #/Barb C /1.1 /9.0
69 /Dunlop ultex # 0.73 /#Barb C #/2.0 /9.9
70 /Dunlop 204 #/Drew Lyman /1.9 /7.7
71 /Sam R—? #Heavy /Unknown /0.9 /9.3
72 /McPherson Design studio /#Unknown /3.4 /6.9

Note 1: This pick produced the brightest tone of all I tested with the high frequencies
boosted, but it was marginal on the G string.

[Keith Newell]

Daryl, Im very impressed with your effort and find the numbers very interesting. So Ideally you want a low first number and high second number. It is amazing to see numericaly what your gut has been telling you as far as to certain picks you have played. Good work!
Keith Newell
http://newellmandolins.com

[Michael Lewis]

That should mean that the use of some picks would be much preferred to reduce "pick noise" with a piezo transducer. Looks like the Dunlop 208 and Dunlop ultex 1.14mm should be great picks for such application. Now I wonder how many other factors need to be considered.

[mandopete]

WOW! I thought the bus had been carved up and sold for parts!

Daryl, thank you for all of your scientific efforts in evaluating these picks. Please let me know who the next recipient was so we can keep track of these. So much time has gone by that some people have dropped off the list.

Pete Goodall

[BenE]

I think I'm next on the tour....I got an email about a month or so ago with my name being the next on the list...

[mandopete]

Here's the names I show still on the list:

Ben Ellis
Ira Kittrell
Jeff Sanders
Larry Wellman
Jeff Paradise
Dan Hagen

I would suggest that you send a message to next recipient of the tour to make sure they still want to participate.

[BenE]

Hey...thats me!

[jasona]

20 /Dunlop ultex 1.14mm /Mandohack /0.9 /11.0


Wow, who knew my rookie ear could pick this as my favourite pick by FAR. My number two? As of March it is the Dunlop 208 (although it is a bit thicker than I prefer). I think that Daryl has discovered the science behind my ear at least! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Coy Wylie]

After much unscientific experimentation the Ultex is my pick of choice too. Second is the "D’Andrea Tricornercorner 1.5mm," more commonly known as the ProPlex. The Ultex I have been using is a 1.0. I need to try some of those 1.14's.

[mandopete]

Has the bus gone off-roading again?

[ira]

i hope not, i'm #2 on the revised list.
hey ben have you gottem?
if not, darryl , have you sentem?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[strumNgrin]

See attached:
Daryl

[BenE]

I haven't seen them from the post office yet! I figured they would be here anyday since I got that address confirmation email from you Daryl. Can you run that tracking number?

[strumNgrin]

Track & Confirm



Ben,
From the tracking site: www.usps.com I got the following information:

"You entered 0304 7990 0004 9055 7349

Current Status:
We attempted to deliver your item at 12:43 pm on May 29, 2004 in LITTLE ROCK, AR 72205 and a notice was left. It can be redelivered or picked up at the Post Office. If the item is unclaimed, it will be returned to the sender. Information, if available, is updated every evening. Please check again later."

Daryl

[ira]

hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrray!@!!!!!!!!!

[BenE]

Good Grief! I'll check on it this evening...I never got a notice but I do live with three roommates! Hopefully its not on the way back to you. I'll let you guys know ASAP!

[mandopete]

Next time we're gonna add a GPS to the bus http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Oddname]

This tour has made for good clean summer, fall, winter, spring, and (once again) summer fun!

[BenE]

I got the picks today! Thanks folks...rest easy ;)

[ira]

hurray! i'm next, and even better, it will be just intime for pete's original concept- good, clean summer fun!!!!!http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[mandopete]

Any news?

Has the bus gone in the ditch again?

Wazzup?

[ira]

hey ben- how are da pics?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[ira]

just got an email from ben- and pics will be to me sometime next week. the tour rolls on!!!!!!!!http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[mandopete]

Ira - did you ever get the picks?

[mandodebbie]

Since I live in Canada I can't participate in your little exercise http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif I feel so left out! Anyway, how about we Canadians and other peoples do our own review of picks. (Even dumb ones, like those plastic bread bag thingies.) We could simply e-mail our reviews on this page. Whatya think? (...Sounds of crickets...) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[ira]

not yet! hey ben- have you shipped?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?

[mandopete]

Looks like the bus has gone AWOL again Ira, bummer!

[ira]

summer is still here- and i want some good clean american summer fun!!!!!!!
hey ben are ya out there?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[ira]

the picks have arrived -wooooooooohoooooooo! i'll have em out to the next person (who is?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?) in the next few months:;):

[ira]

so, took my first pickin at the first sheet (btw-number 3 is not in the sheet. there are a few loose picks in a bag- any ideas what number 3 was?). so far the smaller pygmy goat horn is my fav- bright but full sounding on the strum, relatively clean on the pickin- and sweet tremolo it was also really easy to hold and no slip- wonder what it would be like in another shape. also where do you get these picks??? interesting b/c i didn't like the bigger one as much. i also like the med. teardrop ivory, but it got a little clicky on the pickin. i dug the dawg as well- my first time trying one. and the large teardrop ivory, though that was a tad pointy- i felt like it was getting stuck when i dug a little at the strings. but the sound was gorgeous.

[mandopete]

Ira - Glad to hear the picks finally arrived, that is good news.

I think #3 was one of my "mystery" picks, I hope it is not lost!

The Pygmy Goat Horn was the real sleeper for me too. #Oddly shaped and without much in the way of finishing (they looked like a potato chip to me), but sounded great.

I'm really looking forward to gettting these picks back someday. #Next up should be Larry Wellman (Jeff Sanders cancelled), but you should contact him first before sending them out to make sure he still wants them.

Thanks!

[mandopete]

I think #3 was one of my "mystery" picks, I hope it is not lost!
I take that back - if you look at the picture I posted at the beginning of this thread you will see #3 (top row, third from left) and hopefully it is still in the tour.

[mandopete]

.........and a week later?

[ira]

sorry, had a surprise visit from out of towners this weekend. should be done within the week and on to the next person.

[mandopete]

Thanks Ira. Next up should be Larry Wellman. You may want to contact him and make sure he still wants the picks.

[strumNgrin]

Hey Ira,
When I got the picks, they were all over in the box. it took a couple hours of comparing pictures and descriptions to get them back in order. I think a little magic tape across the open pockets would certainly be helpful for shipping. Happy pickin' & thanks again to Pete.
Daryl

[mandopete]

Any word on the wherabouts of the picks?

[ira]

on the way to larry wellman. lots of fun.
my fav was the small pygmy goat horn, but in terms of the everyday available picks (well not near me)that i hadn't tried, i liked the dunlop ultex. no matter which guage- (though prob liked the 1.0 best) easy to hold, easy to strum, no ambient pic noise, niiiiiiiiiiiiiice!

[ira]

oh yeah, also liked a pick called a "galli" its a triangle shaped- never heard of it, but really nice.

[Mark Levesque]

I just became aware of the pick tour.
(i've been hanging out in the classical and jazz discussions)

What an adventure!

I realize that mandopete must be anxious to get his babies back, but is there time for one more stop?

Cheers,
Mark

[Keith Newell]

Ira, I put the Galli in. I use one that I put a hole pattern in the center kind of like the Wegan picks and I rounded the corns a bit like the new Dawg pick. It has a sweet tone. You can get them at bigcitystrings.com
Keith Newell

[ira]

thanks keith- really nice pick. i'll be looking to get a couple.

added in 2 more for those of you still in the list.

[WireBoy]

Pete-
any chance of getting my name on the list for the second leg of the tour?

[mandopete]

Any sight of the tour bus ?

[ira]

larry did answer a pm through the cafe if you want to go that route with him for contact.

[mandolinplayer]

I'm wondering where the pick tour is now. Hope to get to try them when they come to Portland, OR - near the end of the 1st leg of the tour.

[futrconslr]

Ok....I have been lurking this thread for what seems like years....who has the picks? This should have been a reality t.v. show.

[jasona]

Is the bus off the road?

[Milan Christi]

This is undoubtedly one of the coolest projects I've ever seen on the internet! I'm totally blown away - pure genius at work here. If there's any way I can get added to the list, please shoot me an email or PM. No big deal, though - reading this thread restores a lot of faith I like to have in people.

[Evets]

Yes please, Sounds like a blast!

[glauber]

Me too!

[mikeyes]

Is there a comprehensive collation of opinions abouth these picks available? I realize that each mandolin will react differently to each pick, but it would be interesting to see how all the participants felt about the picks.

I am running a similar effort on Comando right now with fewer picks and fewer participants (one member wrote back telling me that it had already been done, here) and we will be rating the picks for each of our instruments on a Word or Excell format.

[R. Kane]

If the bus starts up again, may I suggest the inclusion of my current favorite, the heavy Plectr'o in green, designated as the smooth jazz model. A bit noisy, but you always know where the point is (or is not in this case). And I hope the bus will stop here.

Richard

[mandopete]

Man, I thought this old puppy was dead! Sorry to say the bus has been scrapped and is now making an appeareance as low-income housing for the M.A.S. afflicted.

You know...if someone else were to start this up again it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world...

[ShaneJ]

Well, what would it take?

[OdnamNool]

mandodude. And his (2) cheerleaders, me and Django Fret. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[Onesound]

Only having started to hang out here the past two months or so, I missed the opportunity to get on the list when it was active. If it ever starts up again, I'll be watching and waiting.

Cheers,
Brian

[glauber]

Only having started to hang out here the past two months or so, I missed the opportunity to get on the list when it was active. If it ever starts up again, I'll be watching and waiting.
Same here. I have a few picks i could contribute too.

[mikeyes]

There is a mini-tour on CoMando right now. We have 6 participants and it should cycle to me in about a month. If you are interested, email me and maybe we can extend the tour a little.

Included are Tortis, Wegen, Dunlop, a generic horn, and about 20 others. We include an Excel template to rate the picks on your mandolins. Results will be published at the end of the tour.

No TS because we are sending the tour outside the country (and for other reasons such as we have no TS.)

Mike Keyes

[aimee]

A comprehensive opinion of all the picks? That would be really hard to remember because they were at my house a year ago. I do remember that it really brightened up a dull week in winter, and that I started using (and pushing to anyone who'd listen) the Ultex 1.0.

[glauber]

and that I started using (and pushing to anyone who'd listen) the Ultex 1.0.
Better than the Ultex 1.14?