Mandolin Ragas or Raga Grass

[phillawrencemandolin]

I've been experimenting with a new style of world fusion music playing fiddle tunes to tabla and tanpura accompaniment. They are free improvisations based on old time melodies and original compositions played on mandolin and tabla, but influenced by Indian classical music. The mandolin sort of weaves in and around classic American melodies above the trance-like drone of an electronic tanpura with tabla accompaniment. The goal is to imagine how Ravi Shankar would have played Old Joe Clark or Cluck Old Hen if Ravi Shankar played the mandolin. Lisa Sangita Moskow plays tabla with me We're playing a concert at Yoga Studio Ganesha in Sebastopol April 3rd if anyone lives in Northern California and wants to hear us. Listen to sample recordings at: http://phillawrence.com/RecordingsDream.html and http://www.lisamoskow.com/ I'm curious to see what other people think. I kinda like it, but I'm not sure where to take this genre. Feedback is welcome. Cheers, Phil Lawrence

[JEStanek]

Pretty interesting, Phil. I liked it and would like to spend more time with it. Thanks for sharing the link. An FYI to other lookers, there are other cool samples on the lined page than just the Indian melange. Very tasty playing, indeed.

Jamie

[jim_n_virginia]

pretty cool I like it! But I kept waiting for the tunes to launch off and pick it up with the other Indian instruments but it never did but I didn't listen to all them just Angeline and Old Joe.

Gives me a lot of ideas! I can hear a guitar droning in drop D while mandolin starts off slow like that that!

Thanks!
:mandosmiley:

[Jim Nollman]

Great idea, Phil. You are definitely onto something original. So many traditional tunes are already modal, that they naturally pull towards eastern tonalities and structure. If you don't know these tunes already, Check out Kitchen Girl with its harmonic shift from A major to A minor, or Wild Rose of the Mountain with its huge hole between the lines.

I'm exploring something similar right now, sampling mandolin in an effort to deconstruct a few different traditional melodies by looping and layering specific phrases and extending specific notes.

I'm curious, are you working in Protools?

[Laird]

I'm with you! Might be heresy to say so on this site, but I think the banjo has a natural synergy with ragas, too.

Have you heard New Monsoon's Live at Telluride?

[Aran]

Wow great tone... Love it!!

How do you find the Indian timing??? It's a mind melt in my opinion :grin:

A friend of mine in Ireland did a masters in Indian classical music on the Sitar and one memorable jam I attended with him and other Indian musicians including tabla, fiddle and some weird chrome Indian banjo that I can't remember the name of was mind blowing.... literally!!! They put on a drone cd in the key of C for the whole night and at some point the mushrooms came out and it all got really funky.... The only tune I really know in C is Billy in the lowground.... We did it with Sitars and all and it really worked... Again though the time signature was totally out there, something like 8/10 or something... can't remember exactly.... ~Oh and the tune went on for an hour or so...

Anyhoo I like where you are going with this... Rock on...:mandosmiley:

[Aran]

Still listening to all your great tracks.... thanks a lot for sharing...

Really love the title Angeline the Bhudda!!! Never enjoyed playing the baker so it's a vast improvement...

I'm curious about your mandolin now.... really lovely tone... What's your axe dude??

[Aran]

Ohm Shanti

[JEStanek]

Aran he plays an old F2. There's lots info on his site. Past Mando Symposium instructor. Guess he has the skills, huh :)

Jamie

[Aran]

yeah absolutely great stuff....

Sorry yes I had a further look at the site and saw the F2 after I had posted the question.... lovely mandolin....

[Dave Gumbart]

Phil - terrific playing - I enjoyed it (stuff on the first link you posted). I particularly liked Ganesha Returns, with a great groove between you and the percussion. I like New Orelans second line rhythyms, and while I'm not trying to make a comparison between the two, I guess I respond to a good backbeat. I also liked Bonaparte's Blues a lot. And that's a nice tip of the cap to Ol' Joe Craven. Camptown has been one of my favorites since it came out.

Anyway, good stuff!

Dave

[Rob Gerety]

Very cool. Made my day!
I wonder - would it fall apart of you tried it up tempo - at dance speed? I'm thinking of Bonaparte's Blues. Probably not your intent - just a thought that maybe this could be adapted to a contra dance.

[Aran]

Some Sitar/Indian classical music is indeed very fast paced and high octane.... I'm sure it would work just as well.

[phillawrencemandolin]

Thanks Jim. The tunes can launch. The potential is there. The samples I put up are shortened versions. So they evolve a lot more. Whether they actually launch or not I'm not sure. But do they have to launch? Perhaps it's okay if they float and drift and disappear. I dunno. That's why I say I like it, but I'm not sure what to think. Anyway, I uploaded the full tracks yesterday to an online store that will distribute the project all over in about two weeks. Thanks for your feedback.

[phillawrencemandolin]

Thanks for the feedback Jim. I'll look into those tunes you suggested. I'm not using Protools. I'm using Samplitude/Sequoia. I rerecorded the Mandala project with a real live tabla player last December and I used a Neumann mike, so the new recording sounds even better. I've uploaded the tracks to an online distributor and they should be available for download in a week or two.

[phillawrencemandolin]

I heard New Monsoon once and I liked them very much. I also toy around with the tenor banjo and I think it works equally well with the Raga Grass thing.

[phillawrencemandolin]

The drone I used on my first Mandala project was a computer program. I like it because you can change keys, so you have choices. Before I discovered this program I was hesitant to try blending Indian and bluegrass music because I didn't want to play in C all night long. The second Mandala Project, which I just uploaded to a download distributor, has a Raagini--a portable box that also can be programmed to drone in different keys. Lisa Sangita Moskow plays tabla with me. She's been playing Indian classical music for forty years so she knows what she's doing. I don't. I'm just improvising. She also plays sarod and when we play live she brings that along and I switch to tabla. Again, I don't know what I'm doing, but I try to keep a simple backbeat for her while she improvises. As for time signature, again I plead ignorance. I'm just drifting in and out of measures and bars, suggesting the melody and drifting away from it.

[phillawrencemandolin]

Have you heard Chris Thile's version of Angeline the Baker with David Grier? That's my ideal. But I can't do what he does, so I did a version that suited my abilities. But Thile plays the best Angeline I ever heard. In a sense, my Buddha is a tribute to Chris Thile. And yes I play a 1916 F2 Gibson oval hole. It has a wonderful low end, deep and smooth.

[phillawrencemandolin]

I love Joe Craven. He's an inspiration. Camptown is a favorite of mine, especially "Ol Joe's Deli", which I kinda had in mind, though I knew I could never attain the level of intensity he put into that track. I agree, a good backbeat is important. I posted shortened samples of tracks that are more extended and usually they break into backbeats later. Thanks for the feedback.

[phillawrencemandolin]

I posted shortened versions of tracks that are longer and they usually pick up in tempo after 3 to six minutes of rubato non rhythmic floating. I like to float and I like to have intense rhythms also. Something about just floating timelessly without necessarily having to go anywhere is liberating, Think of a hot summer day floating on an inflatable raft in the middle of a cool blue lake. But then you have to slip off the raft and swim to shore.

[phillawrencemandolin]

Very true. I listen to Ravi Shankar quite a bit. He's the ideal.

[Steve K]

Excellent stuff, thanks for sharing! It works really well.

I've been intrigued by adding the drone of a tamboura/tanpura/etc. but figured I wasn't going to find one at my local Hot Licks guitar shop.