What does nicer mean, and what for $2k?

[jamfan]

I recently took up the mandolin and play a Kentucky KM-675.

I've noticed that the mandolinists in my favorite bands play instruments that costs over $10,000.

If I want to upgrade, what does it mean to buy a nicer mandolin? That is, what do the higher end mandos have that mine doesn't?

Also, if I were to spend $2,000 on a used mandolin, what are some recommendations?

[sunburst]

This question parallels the thread that is in progress about the differences in mandolins.

As you go up in quality (and in price, though not always directly proportionally) the differences become more and more subtle, and frankly are often undetectable by inexperienced players. A new player can get perfectly good service form a mandolin costing much less than $2000. It's like someone said; "Lance Armstrong can kick your butt on a 40 lb. Huffy", but the other side of that is; Lance can get a lot more out of his bike than you can, and in fact most of us couldn't begin to appreciate what Lance's bike has to offer because we're just not capable of riding at that level. It's the same with mandolins. The guys in your favorite bands, playing $10,000 mandolins would be playing (maybe...) $1000 mandolins if there wasn't something about those $10,000 that they are capable of using and appreciating, and folks like us might not even hear/feel what it is they're hearing/feeling. There's a good chance they could find a $5000 mandolin (or less) that would serve them just fine though.

If you have $2000 to spend on a mandolin, you're up there into some darned good A-style mandolins, and if you're buying used you're up there into lifetime quality if you find a good deal. There are do many good builders these days that shopping for a good used 'A' from any of many small builders can hook you up with a top quality mandolin.

[JEStanek]

John's reply is excellent.

What about your Kentucky KM-675 is dissatisfying? Is it the tone, the set up, the fit and finish? If possible, it might be a great exercise to go to a shop or jam or session that has a bunch of instruments and try a number of them out. Be objective, does this one sound or feel better than the one you have? Is a new mandolin worth the expense? Will a new one inspire you to play more and practice faithfully to improve your skills?

If you feel you're working to hard to get the sounds out of your current one then maybe a new instrument is in order. One thing not to expect is that if you have a serviceable instrument right now, any new one will dramatically improve your abilities immediately. That said, there is a thrill and a rush of bonding with a new (to you) instrument.

Jamie

[sunburst]

I forgot to mention;
As long as the quality of a mandolin is a least decent, playability is over 95% set up. A good $1000 or less mandolin can be set up to play just as well as a $10,000+ mandolin.

[Chuck Naill]

I recently took up the mandolin and play a Kentucky KM-675.

I've noticed that the mandolinists in my favorite bands play instruments that costs over $10,000.

If I want to upgrade, what does it mean to buy a nicer mandolin? That is, what do the higher end mandos have that mine doesn't?

Also, if I were to spend $2,000 on a used mandolin, what are some recommendations?

That $10K figure really surprises me. While I am not much of a concert attender, I never see players with expensive instruments around here.

For one thing, there is not that much money to be made playing and with modern amplification technology these folks are more focuses on playability and good setups as John mentioned being possible on less expensive instruments.

If I were looking into possibly looking for a new mandolin, I would look here, http://www.hamlettinstruments.com/instruments.php http://www.hamlettinstruments.com/images/14-2_1.png In my mind, I could not get anymore by spending $10K. Perhaps John does something extra for that price. :grin:

[allenhopkins]

Lots of good used stuff around for $2K -- A-model Gibsons, Webers, Flatiron A's, possibly some Collings MT's, and many miscellaneous. Your Kentucky lists for around $1K, obtainable for less than $800 new. What are you getting for the difference?

Well, depends on the individual instrument, IMHO. One thing you can get is an American-made mandolin; this is important to some people, irrelevant to others. If you buy used, you're unlikely to get manufacturer warranty protection, which doesn't mean much to me, but, again, is important to others. Used to say that you'd get a "pro grade" instrument, but now the top-end Asian imports are certainly performance quality, and you can get almost all of them new for $2K, give or take.

Sound, appearance, playability -- these are so tied to the characteristics of each individual instrument, that it's hard to generalize. Is every used Weber better in these areas, than every Kentucky, The Loar, or Eastman? I'd be leery of making a blanket statement. Is the average better? Probably. But you're not buying the average.

There's many a pro player that walks out on stage with an absolute top-end instrument, costing well into the five figures. Even more, if you're talking about a Lloyd Loar Gibson. But some of that, IMHO, comes with being a "pro," and wanting to have a recognizable top-rank instrument to play. J.J. Cale used to perform with a rebuilt Harmony guitar, 'cause he loved its sound. I bet Willie Nelson could afford a guitar that didn't have holes worn through the top. If I were making my living playing bluegrass (that's not going to happen!), I'd lay out the buxx for at least a Gibson DMM or equivalent small-builder axe, sorta like carrying a musician's union card, or ensuring that I was seen as a respectable picker.

Excellent advice from Jamie above. Take your KM-675 into a good dealer's showroom, with an afternoon to kill. Play it, play the higher-priced ones, and see what they've got that you haven't. If anything. More expensive doesn't necessarily mean better -- especially when so many components of "better" are pretty subjective.

There are thousands of mandolins you can buy with $2K. (That is, $2K each.) Undoubtedly you'd like some of them better than what you have. Others not so much. Play two dozen of them, and see what you think. Don't be too influenced by what you see on stage or on YouTube. Your mandolin is yours.

[Tim2723]

I think there's a distinction to be made. Many a well known celebrity player walks out with five-figure instrument, while many a working professional walks out with a good, but more modestly priced mandolin.

[JeffD]

That is not to say there is no difference at all, in sound or playability or fit or finish between what you can typically get for $2K and what you can typcially get for five figures. Of course there is.

Whether the differences are appreciated, or deemed worth the difference in price, is something each player determines individually.

[bigbike]

I recently took up the mandolin and play a Kentucky KM-675.

I've noticed that the mandolinists in my favorite bands play instruments that costs over $10,000.

If I want to upgrade, what does it mean to buy a nicer mandolin? That is, what do the higher end mandos have that mine doesn't?

Also, if I were to spend $2,000 on a used mandolin, what are some recommendations?

I think that the other answers are all pretty good. The answer to your question would be to ask yourself, what is it that I am NOT getting out of my mandolin? Is it that certain tone? Is it a radiused (if yours is flat) or vice versa fretboard for easier play. Is there something about the appearance I like with another instrument? I myself am only beginning mandolin. Right now I have 3 instruments at my house. An old A style that I got into playable condition, an old banjo-mandolin that is unplayable because of a structure flaw and an old high quality bowlback mandolin. Of all the instrument, the bowlback is my favorite right now. It is 100 years old, but has the sweetest tone, best sustain and does everything I need it to do-from rock music to bluegrass and everything in between it does it all. I am sure that in the hands of a capable musician it would do even more. Banjo is my first instrument and I also have a lot of those. My final choice in bluegrass banjo is a top of the line pacrim import. WHY? Because of tone and ease of play. To me and to most people who play and instrument it is all about tone.

The point is play what sounds good to you, and does the job you need it to do.

I myself am curious why the Old (pre 1915) Gibson A's are the mandolin of choice of so many rock musicians? Sure some play others, but those old paddlehead plain janes must have something that those folks need. And I am betting it is as simple as tone.

[FarewellDrifter]

When faced with this dilemma, I went to places like Gruhn Guitars or elderly and played everything they had. I found the Collings Mt's to be mindboggling. I couldnt find one I didnt love. Personal preference with Collings but you should try the Gibson a9's, Weber Gallatins, Etc and see what you like. I have seen these for under 2.

Then it comes down to "how much are the upgrades worth." Like getting an F Style is basically 2 g's more just for cosmetics. It is really important to figure out what you are going for with the sound. If I wanted to sound like Chris Thile, I would think lessons are a better investment than Varnish finish, and etc. If you are doing your own thing, maybe the KY mando is part of you sound. I recently played a show with Joe Craven who blew my socks off with his Kentucky Mandolin.



And a good set up is the most important thing to being happy.

[terzinator]

Another vote for looking at a Collings MT... I had a Kentucky 855, and it was a dream to play... But in a jam situation, the Collings has just that much more volume, depth and tone... (I know there are other brands out there that have similar characteristics; not just Collings.)

I might upgrade someday, maybe to an MT2, but I can't really see the need at this point. These little Collings MTs are great. Mine has ivoroid binding and a wide neck, and I got it for $1700 used. They are out there if you look.

[mandroid]

Seems a response, pragmatic, really, when someone asks : "If I change ..
[ Pick the part] the Tuners, Nut, Bridge and/or Tailpiece on my Xyz mandolin will the tone improve ?

Seems .. would imply that it is less than satisfactory, then a solution is ...
gather what you learned from the instrument you own, and seek something with the features you wish It had.

[un5trung]

Personal preference with Collings but you should try the Gibson a9's, Weber Gallatins, Etc and see what you like

And try used instruments. I have an Eastman A-style, a Weber Gallatin, and a Weber Sage, all used, and all for much less than their advertised prices. I think a used Gibson a9 or A-style Jam Master would be great buys. And I can't say enough about my Weber Gallatin.