Help a dumb mandolin-newbie?

[AC4RD]

Well, first I should apologize because this is the sort of thing that probably comes up twice a week, and if there's a DUMB_NEWBIE.FAQ just point me to it. #:-)

I've been playing guitar very badly for nearly 30 years. #About two weeks ago I succumbed to a longstanding urge and bought a mandolin--a very cheap one, used. # I am having a WORLD of fun with this thing! #The simple fretboard means I can work out simple flatpicking runs despite my lack of brainpower, and I *love* the sound of the mandolin! #My biggest technical problem just now is learning the "tough" chords, and getting over the urge to transpose every song I hit into either D or G. #;-) #I'm doing simple bluegrass stuff, and also playing stuff like old Dylan songs("I shall be released" works GREAT on the mandolin!)--I still haven't found a key in which the Dead's "Bertha" works really well but I'd love to hear from anybody who does that one. #;-)

After two weeks with my $50 used "Eagle" A-style mandolin, I am now eager to get a mandolin that stays in tune, and one in which all the strings are relatively equally "live." #It looks like A styles are a bit cheaper than the F styles, for the same general level of quality--but after years of watching and listening to my bluegrass heros, I'd really prefer the F style.

What I still don't understand is this: #Is there some significant difference between A and F styles? #I mean, does one sound generally different from the other? #Or is it really mainly cosmetic? #Are there subtle factors that I should be aware of? #Do THOSE people play one style while the GOOD people play the other style? #I'd really love an F-style but given my limited budget (it has to stay below the Wife Radar's range, meaning a couple of hundred, used), an A might get me closer to decent quality than the coveted F. #Being a dumb newbie to the world of mandolins, I'd be glad to get opinions, advice, and comments from the experienced folks. #If you would rather keep it off this nice discussion page, you can always email me directly at ken.kuzenski@duke.edu.

THANKS!
#--Ken the Newbie Mandoliner .. Mandolinist? #Mandolinick?

[Flowerpot]

Hi, and welcome to the cafe!

Well, your topic does come up from time to time, and since I don't know if we have an FAQ handy, I'll chime in here with the general consensus: The differences between F and A styles are 99.9% cosmetic. Since the scroll adds significant cost to building a mandolin, for a fixed amount of money, you will be able to buy a better sounding and playing A style. (Feel free to pile on here if I'm over-generalizing.)

As for finding a decent instrument for $200, well, that's a tough row to hoe. You do want something that stays in tune, and sounds balanced... well, you might have to raise the ante a bit. But look around, there are a lot of used instruments on the market now.

[fatt-dad]

fatt-dad has an add for mandolins at the Cafe web page. The title is something about mid-priced mandolins, it may be on page 2 or 3 by now. My humble opinion is that there are nice $200 or $300 mandolins that when you are done using them you can sell for $200 or $300. O.K. maybe you will "loose" $50.oo or shipping charges, but not much else.

If you want to get a "lifelong" mandolin, first you have to work through MAS (mandolin aquisition syndrome). It is fun and does not have to be expensive. From my collection, I have found some good A-style mandolins that are fun to own.

So, drop me a line and I can further describe some mandolins for sale. I am still trying to get good photos, but I will get my act together.

Fatt-dad

[Eugene]

...and since I don't know if we have an FAQ handy...
We do, and I just happened to write this small, heavily edited section of it: Mandolin Types FAQ (http://www.mandolincafe.com/archives/faq.html#mandolintypes).

[Eric F.]

Well, Ken, you might as well have asked what we think of Chris Thile's hair. Or if that band of his is really bluegrass. The A vs. F thing has been debated at length. Some people say they can tell the difference blindfolded. I suspect most cannot.

Every mandolin is different, even the same model from the same mass producer. But I believe that you are spot on in your guess _ the A style will get you more for your dollar. The scroll is quite labor intensive and adds a lot to the price. Some call it an expensive strap hanger.

Your price range is a tough one. One of Fatt-dad's mandos might be the answer. Otherwise, I would probably recommend getting a Kentucky 250 from someone who will set it up properly (Elderly Instruments for one, but there are others). That means passing on the ones you see on eBay and paying a little more, but it will be worth it because it will be playable.

I struggled with guitar off and on for years before discovering the mandolin. It just makes sense to me, which the guitar never did. So, welcome to the Cafe, and to mandolin playing. To mandolining? To being a mandolinista?

[TommyK]

fatt-dad has an add for mandolins at the Cafe web page. #The title is something about mid-priced mandolins, it may be on page 2 or 3 by now. #My humble opinion is that there are nice $200 or $300 mandolins that when you are done using them you can sell for $200 or $300. O.K. maybe you will "loose" $50.oo or shipping charges, but not much else.

If you want to get a "lifelong" mandolin, first you have to work through MAS (mandolin aquisition syndrome). #It is fun and does not have to be expensive. #From my collection, I have found some good A-style mandolins that are fun to own.

So, drop me a line and I can further describe some mandolins for sale. #I am still trying to get good photos, but I will get my act together.

Fatt-dad
So how do I find Fatt-dad's add?
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[FrankenMouse]

Here it is:

The Ad of fatt-dad (http://www.mandolincafe.com/cgi-bin/classifieds/classifieds.cgi?search_and_display_db_button=on&db_id=10891&query=retrieval)

[Dave Caulkins]

Howdy (and welcome to MAS),

I'm a staunch supporter of A-model mandolins (read: I do not, nor will I, own an "F" model... however I can find lots of ways to spend money on A's and two-points). That darn scroll just ends up costing too much... and this coming from someone with MAS for a Rigel Jethro... when will I ever learn!

On Bertha: What's wrong with the "real" key of G/C? The A minor chord? Otherwise you have lots of G, C, D to play around with. Yeah, the chromatic ascending part (C, Db, D) is kinda tricky, but perservere - I doubt you'll find a better (ie easier) key. By the way, in case you didn't guess, I have done this one. "Chop" chords work really well on this tune. My band makes me play in Eb ALOT!

Welcome aboard... and good luck with the spouse - eventually they tolerate if not understand!

Dave

[duuuude]

Ken,

I was in your same spot a couple years ago, don't worry 'bout looks for now just get the best quality and playability for your buck. Once you've been playin' awhile you'll have a better idea of what to upgrade to, and your improved playin' will help convince the wife that the next one is an investment. Worked for me at least.

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[mysticfaery]

[B]I'm so glad you asked that question,because I wondered about it myself! I have a Kentucky KM 140,and am starting to look at possibly getting a better A model for under $300 if possible-glad to see the link to the sales.

[AC4RD]

Bertha: What's wrong with the "real" key of G/C? The A minor chord? Otherwise you have lots of G, C, D to play around with.
My real problem with it is that C just doesn't sound like a very strong chord on the mandolin. (To ME, that is.)#Guitar: strong bass note, lots more good notes. #C on the mando seems weaker-sounding--but I don't MIND that, because lovely lovely D is just flat WONDERFUL on the mandolin. #Also, "Bertha" is a little tricky for a newbie--I've been playing with those guitar changes and rhythm shifts since Jerry Garcia's beard was jet-black, but getting my big fat fingers on the mando fretboard is still a bit of work. :-) #

But my major message in this reply is to ** THANK YOU GREAT MANDOLIN FANS FROM THE MANDOLIN CAFE !! * !! * !! #I got a ton of useful information, opinion, and advice, and I'm compelled to tell you how much I appreciate it! #There are some net discussion sites that are good, a lot that are appalling, and a very very few where there are lots of smart people who are generous about sharing their knowledge. #"Mandolin Cafe" is one of the GREAT ones, and I am very grateful! #(And, yes, I have made a contribution to the Plucked String Foundation and will repeat it RSN.)

BTW: my A-vs-F quandry may have been resolved; I'm very pleased about that. #More RSN. #:-) #
#--Ken the Newbie Mandoliner .. Mandolinocrat? Mand .. <ah> .. ?