Fat Fingers?

[Brown]

I just got my first mandolin today (a Kentucky 505), and I'm trying to learn the basic two-finger chords.

Here's my question: I'm having a very hard time playing C Major or F Major without deadening a string on either side of my index finger. The weird thing is that I have skinny fingers (for a guy). Is it just a matter of developing calluses so that the skin doesn't squish out on either side? Is it just a matter of technique? Is this one of those things that can't be diagnosed over the internet?

Thanks.

[Andrew DeMarco]

Welcome to the world of mando and welcome to the cafe:)

I remember when I saw a picture of a 2 finger chord and was like WTF I have to move my hand like THAT?!?!? Now I can grab a closed 4 finger chord no problem at high speeds....


Practice....!

Try this:
When you fret a new chord, play all the strings. If it sounds deadened or muted, play each string one by one to see which string is being muted, then adjust your grip. Once you get it sounding good and clear, take your hand off. Rinse and Repeat....

I'm sure much more talented individuals will chime in but that's my advice:)

[chordbanger]

Bring your wrist out a little bit, and bring your index finger down on the note like a hammer coming down on a nail, using the tip of your finger. Also, watch your thumb hold on the back of the neck. Thumb hold is very important when playing any stringed instrument and will affect the way the rest of your fingers come down on the notes. Thumb should be resting against the back, not sticking out over the top of the neck and not grasping tightly.

[Ravenwood]

Many beginners tend to use the pads of their fingers rather than the tips thus causing the adjacent string to deaden.

Andrew's suggestion is a good one, and while you are testing each string look closely to see if your fingers are arched or flat.

[Michael Gowell]

The most useful single tip IMHO is...keep your thumb (on your fretting hand) pointed at the headstock. That insures that your fretting fingers address the frets from above, not sideways.

[Brown]

Thanks all. I looked at some videos, and my hand was positioned incorrectly. I'm trying to keep my thumb pointed at the headstock, and I'm getting a much clearer sound.

[Andrew DeMarco]

Also, remember that are allowed to hold the mandolin angled away from your body to reduce the strain on your write while you try to maintain good position. Also, taking the back of the mando off your body will increase the sound production by avoiding damping the back:)

[EdHanrahan]

And plus also too...

Folks here, constantly & correctly, harp on having a good setup, which does many good things. In your case, having the strings as low as practicable at the nut ensures that the strings adjacent to the fretted one(s) are "ducking out of the way" of your fretting fingers, and thus sounding clearly.

Keep at it. And Enjoy!

[mandroid]

check out left hand postures of violin players.

[Rob Gerety]

The Mike Marshall DVDs give a good grounding in proper hand position. Also, you can often favor one side or another of the string course you are fretting to avoid muting an adjacent string.

[Anglocelt]

At the risk of stating the obvious, you could try a mandolin with a wider fretboard. The standard F5/ A5 fretboard has always struck me as too narrow. Just because Lloyd Loar preferred narrow fretboards does mean the rest of us have to. Guitar players often say they have given up on mandolin because the fretboard is too crowded but not all mandolins are like that. Most European makers (outside Italy) serving the 'Celtic' music market and Brazilian luthiers make wider fretboards than is typical in the USA. Do post-1923 Americans have skinnier fingers? The Gibson Sam Bush model, with its wider fretboard, did not catch on apparently but why not?

I am used to playing older Gibson A models, which have wider fretboards, and I have problems with the typical F5 width although I don't have fat fingers. Why did Loar narrow the fretboard? Is there any benefit to be had for the average mandolin player? Can we return to fretboard sanity or is it too late?

Kevin Thomas

[Michael Gowell]

I'm not sure that the Sam Bush model didn't "catch on" - lots of raves for it, especially for its powerful sound in addition to the wider fingerboard.

[fishtownmike]

At the risk of stating the obvious, you could try a mandolin with a wider fretboard. The standard F5/ A5 fretboard has always struck me as too narrow. Just because Lloyd Loar preferred narrow fretboards does mean the rest of us have to. Guitar players often say they have given up on mandolin because the fretboard is too crowded but not all mandolins are like that. Most European makers (outside Italy) serving the 'Celtic' music market and Brazilian luthiers make wider fretboards than is typical in the USA. Do post-1923 Americans have skinnier fingers? The Gibson Sam Bush model, with its wider fretboard, did not catch on apparently but why not?

I am used to playing older Gibson A models, which have wider fretboards, and I have problems with the typical F5 width although I don't have fat fingers. Why did Loar narrow the fretboard? Is there any benefit to be had for the average mandolin player? Can we return to fretboard sanity or is it too late?

Kevin Thomas
Loar built his mandolin with techniques borrowed from violin building. So that might have something to do with the narrower fret boards. Another posibility is maybe he had hopes that this would make it easier for a violinist to cross over to the mandolin???

[astroboy]

... hopefully some more callus/fretting questions fit in with this thread ...

After a few months of playing the mando, I've gone through the slight ouchies of no calluses, development of some calluses, the slight stickiness/shredding of soft calluses after any dish washing, and now it's gotten a bit strange ...

... the left hand fretting fingertip calluses seem to have toughened versus the first development, but have ridges worn (depressions) where the strings are fretted -- forcing me to fret harder to avoid buzzing when picking with any volume and more likely (because the callus is molded to the string courses) to touch the adjacent string as the side of the finger gets closer to the fretboard. I'm practicing about 1.5 hrs 5 times a week.

:) Now, while I'm sort of happy that I'm consistent enough to fret in exactly the same place on each finger, is there another stage that follows or is it time to start emery board filing the calluses?

P.S. I've got some of the Climb On! on order (it's dry here in the winter, so that's probably needed regardless for skin cracking elsewhere) as discussed in other posts, so that might help as well.

Thanks for any insight from the long term fretting folks ... and thanks for not going "Eeeww, totally gross ...". ;)

[Philphool]

... hopefully some more callus/fretting questions fit in with this thread ...

After a few months of playing the mando, ........

:) Now, while I'm sort of happy that I'm consistent enough to fret in exactly the same place on each finger, is there another stage that follows or is it time to start emery board filing the calluses?
.....

Absolutely. Gently smooth your calluses as needed. Dry cracked skin is not very helpful for fretting. I use more emory boards for fingertips than for nails, that's for sure.
:mandosmiley: