Should I get a radius fretboard?

[fatt-dad]

Dear NG,

I guess I will always be a passionate, but mediocre mandolin player. I love to buy mandolins and have quite a collection. All of them have flat fretboards and I have never had a moment's of complaint.

I just acquired a Stiver A-model and need to send it back to Mr. Stiver for a partial refret and a new brige. During my discussion, I inquired about having a radius fretboard put on it. He is willing, but I got the impression that he is not a cheerleader for the radius fretboard. His words, "I don't know what all the fuss is about". I guess if you have some big fingers or other "special" need, maybe there is an advantage.

So, here is the question - Should I consider getting my board radiused? If I do, will I end up feeling as if my other mandolins are missing something (i.e., if I get used to the one mandolin with the radius will the others feel weird)? If I do go with the radius, should I go for 4 inches or 10 inches (somewhere inbetween).

You know I love this message board as I just can't ask my wife these important questions.

fatt-dad

[pdlstl]

My Flatiron is en-route to Bryan Kimsey at this very moment for a radius job.

I've played flatboards for a while now and recently played a Gilchrist and a Newson with radiused boards. #I loved 'em both!

[BrazAd]

My new Cole mando has a 12" radius fretboard. It's very comfortable, and not so tight of a radius that you notice it as sharply as others I've seen. Most all guitar fretboards are radiused - Gibson uses 12", Martin uses 16" - so why not a mandolin?

Gary
Atlanta

[JiminRussia]

Many, if not most mandos made today with a radius have a compound radius. It is much tighter at the nut (7 1/2" or so) than at the bridge end of the fretboard (upward to about 20") None of mine have the radius, but those that I have played, I really liked.

[Brad Weiss]

My mandos don't have a radius, but the NEXT one I get certainly will. #Check out a local Breedlove (or Rigel) if you can find one for a test drive. #It really makes for a more playable instrument.

[sunburst]

I know players that love a radius, and I know players that don't want a radius -no way, no how!
As for how much radius, well that's personal preference too.
In short, no one can decide but you.

Those people that have learned to prefer a radius (that includes me) seem to have more trouble playing a flat board than those who prefer a flat board have playing a radius.

[fatt-dad]

very interesting perspectives. I guess living in the Richmond (virginia) vacuum, I will have limited opportunities to try-out different radii or compound radii. Maybe I'll just stay with flat, as I love playing it just like it is.

More comments welcome.

f-d

[pickinNgrinnin]

FD- If you get the Stiver radiused and find that you like it, will the others get radiused too? If not, it's possible that you could develop a preference (in your mind) for the radiused over the flat board. Then...the flat boards gather dust and suffer from neglect? They become distraught and will require therapy.

You could keep the playing surface level by keeping all the boards flat. Doh #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[JiminRussia]

I ditto what sunburst said. I found that the radiused fretbaords that I played were easier to fret, that is they needed less perceived effort, effort and pressure to makea clean note than did the flat fretboards that I played. They also seemed to be just a little bit faster too, so I makes sense that it would be easier to go from flat to radiused than the other way around. I wouldn't say that it was a dramatic diference, but it was noticable, more so on the Collings and Phoenix mandos that I have tried. I haven't tried an M.K. yet, but I've heard that they are pretty good in that department too.

[Potosimando]

If you hold out your relaxed left hand (or right hand, of course) in front of your face you will see a natural little radius curve on all of your fingers.

Now, if you straighten out your index finger on that hand, and make some pretend "air" bar chords...then compare the strength of those "air" bar chords to similar "air" bar chords using the natural radius of your relaxed-hand position, you will see exactly why the radius fretboards are easier to fret.

I prefer my radius fretboards to my flat ones.

[fatt-dad]

If someone saw me trying to visualize method of Potosimando, I would be committed - ha. Regarding easy of play or clearly freting a note, I really do not "feel" that is what I would be trying to address. I feel I have a speed hurdle, whether radius on the fretboard would open the door to faster playing is unclear. No way do I want my other mandolins to gather dust. The fun of having a collection is to pull out a few, get them tuned (change the strings), etc and then have them hanging around for practice. Belive it or not, most of my collection gets regular play. No matter what the overwelming majority of the Board thinks about Pac Rim mandolins, some that I have are great to play on.

Herein lies my delimma - do I really want one mandolin with the radius fretboard. I mean it's not like saying I want an f-style, an A-style, a two-point, some oval holes and an electric. It seems to be a bigger change in the manner of playing the mandolin.

I recently spoke with Cafe member Chas. Johnson about radius fretboards and his take was if you got one you would get used to it and end up avoiding the flat boards in the future. Well, that shuts the door on Gibson mandolins (unless you go to the custom shop). Not that I'm going out to buy a new Gibson anytime soon $$$.

Thanks again for great insight.

f-d

[pdlstl]

"Well, that shuts the door on Gibson mandolins (unless you go to the custom shop). #Not that I'm going out to buy a new Gibson anytime soon $$$."

Not necessarily.

When I said I was sending my Flatiron out for a radiused board, Bryan is going to radius the existing board. I don't want a severe radius, just something gentle.

You may want to try this route rather than a complete replacement board.

I really like my Festival and didn't want to go to a different instrument just for a radiused board. #This way, I get to hang on to an old friend, only new and improved! #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #And IMHO, a rather inexpensive mod.

My 2¢...

[mandogrouch]

so, Gibson doesn't make a radiused fretboard? I don't pay much attention to Gibson, except for really old ones, but it would be interesting to hear from them on why they don't make em w/radiused boards, if that's the case. Not that I care, all my mandos are flat and I doubt I'll ever switch. But, I understand what fatt-dad is saying; you want your setups to be fairly consistent, however I'm sure there are plenty of folks out there that have both and go back an forth easily.

[Brad Weiss]

Fatt-Dad

FYI, few places in driving distance of Richmond (a long drive, but a drive) where you could try out some Breedloves- Picker's Supply in Fredericksburg; Melodee Music in Leesburg. And down in NC Harry's Guitars in Raleigh has a bunch of Rigels and MKs with a radius. Maybe worth a few hours drive to you, dunno.

[fatt-dad]

Thanks BradW,

I recently had about 15 minutes in Pickers Supply en route to meeting my family at Kings Dominion. I played one of the Breedloves and a Gibson A-9. By the time I saw the Collings in the back room, I was out of time. Either case, I really didn't have the time to discriminate the fretboards. I just had enough time to noodle and enjoy the sounds they produced. Maybe I should try to get back and pay more close attention.

f-d

[John Flynn]

I certainly don't want to speak for Gibson, but I am only reporting what I have heard. I believe the Gibson guys made the statement that they will do a radius on any mando model special order, except for the "9" series. Also, the Adam Steffy model was produced with a radius. Frankly, I can see why they don't do it more. They are really aiming at the "traditionalist" market, in fact you could say they own that segment. I think it would be a minority of their buyers who would want a radius and it would create some supply chain/inventory hassles without much upside.

I really like the radius on my Rigel. I am told it is a 9.5" at the nut, tapering to 16" at the end of the fretboard. The whole Rigel neck profile, including the radius, the fat neck and the large frets are my favorite thing about it. It is the most playable mando I have ever tried. If I ever order a full custom mando, I will try to get the builder to copy that.

[sunburst]

I live within 2 hours of Richmond and have one mandolin left at this time. It has a radius.

[Lee]

I suspect if Bill Monroe had been left-handed Gibson would be telling us it's the only proper way to play; but would build a right-handed model on request.

[64lusso]

I have both radiused and flat boards on my mandos and I agree pretty much with what sunburst said but would like to suggest that if you play mostly single note stuff with occasional double stops thrown in for solos and use only open form and chop form chords it probably doesn't make a whole lot of difference which you use. If you also like to play more advanced chords particularly those involving barre chords and others with awkward finger stretches then I think having a radiused fretboard is almost essential.
As far as what radius to use tell him to copy what Rigel does, I think it's one of those compound radius but don't know what the numbers are, my recently purchsed Jethro is the easiest to play mando I have at the moment.

[GBG]

As I mentioned in a previous post about Stiver mandolins, I heard one that sounded great (real BG sound). The owner, who also has a Gilchrist, said his only problem with the Stiver(flat fingerboard) was playability. With that in mind I would definitely be considering a radiused fingerboard for a Stiver. My best mandolin has a compound radius of 5" to 7.5" from the nut to the 12th fret. My other mandolin has a 12" radius(which is next to nothing), and I can really tell the difference in the two.I've had tennis elbow and some hand problems and I grade heavy on playability.

[JD Cowles]

it's all personal taste too. my first mando had a flat board and then i upgraded to a rigel a+ with a radiused board and will never go back. if you can get your hands on a mando with a radius it would be good.
either way you get a new mando...
jd

[Dave Cohen]

F-D, you KNOW that I live IN Richmond. I have one with a 9.5" radius which you can try.

[Lefty&French]

I suspect if Bill Monroe had been left-handed Gibson would be telling us it's the only proper way to play; but would build a right-handed model on request.
[QUOTE]

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[fatt-dad]

Dear NG,

I have decided to go with 10 inches at the nut and 16 (or so) at the bridge. Mr. Stiver says he always uses a compound radius. I guess one item that I ponder is whather to go "flat" for the bridge. He says he can compound to a flat bridge, but I guess 16 inch is pretty close to flat.

(Dave, thanks for the offer to play your Cohen. I would really like to do that but with the recent move, I find it hard to follow this thread, play my mandolin, or test drive others' - maybe some day soon. I fully intend on returning to the Baptist Church one week from tuesday though!)

F-D

BTW, have I mentioned that my Stiver is a great mandolin!

[fatt-dad]

update: Mr. Stiver will do a 7 inch radius at the nut and a 14 inch radius at the bridge. He says that he has had great success with this setup. I'll just have to keep you posted, but I figure I'll love it!

f-d