Hey all you Monroe "In The Knows"

[Scotti Adams]

On the Cafe Home Page..the pic of Mun and his mando..Ive always wondered what the spot was on the lower bout...is it worn wood...and old battle scar...??? Ive seen this spot in many pics pre stoker incident. My inquiring mind wants to know. Its just under his left hand in the pic.

Thanks:popcorn:

[earthsave]

Sorry after I hit send, I realized I was answering the obvious question that you obviously were not asking. I went back and looked at the pic and have not insight into why, but now I anxiously await enlightenment from those one here the do know.

That's from decades of lightly rubbing/brushing finger tips in the same spot.

[RichieK]

Hey Scottie,
I seem to recall from a long time ago that it was a piece of tape...
Richie

[MikeEdgerton]

It's just under his right hand is it not? Is that the spot of wood filler that Randy Wood put there that was mentioned in an earlier post to combat wear?

See Darryl Wolfe's post on page two of this (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=45591&page=2) thread.

[Scotti Adams]

Nope..its under his left hand on the side rim

[woodwizard]

I think he might be talking about on the side there where it looks like it's sort of goughed out some. There just to the left and down a little from his left hand in the pic. May be wrong?

above beat me to it....

[JEStanek]

You mean this?
No idea myself. Probably a scuff! ~o)

Jamie

[Scotti Adams]

You mean this?
No idea myself. Probably a scuff! ~o)

Jamie

Yep..that would be it. Thanx.

Maybe Ol Bill tested his trusty case knife there before he went for the peg head.

[MikeEdgerton]

That would be the side of the upper bout so now I see what you're talking about as far as the bouts go.

[f5loar]

I'm surprised Darryl Wolfe has not jumped on this one. Seems we looked at under extreme microscope and came to the conclusion it was a little piece of old rotted masking tape. The reason why we could not figure out.
The first time I can recall seeing is on the cover of the 1977 Bill Monroe
"Sings Bluegrass, Body and Soul" MCA 2251 in which it seems to be rather new looking masking tape. And it appears to have something written on it too. Maybe an old girlfriend's phone number!

[RichieK]

Tom,
That's what I thought. Given Bills ancestry, I was surprised that it wasn't 'Scotch' tape.:)

[f5loar]

I do believe Scotch does make a high grade masking tape. After all it has been on there a long time without coming loose.

[Scotti Adams]

Thanks guys! Now I can sleep at night.

[evanreilly]

Ummm...
He covered up some previous sweetie's initials.
After all, he had 'W.S.M. & B.L.M.' scratched on the top. :)

[mrmando]

After all, he had 'W.S.M. & B.L.M.' scratched on the top. :)

Bureau of Land Management?

[Scotti Adams]

Mun sure had a pinchant for carving didnt he?

[jimbob]

I get worried about scratching the mandolin with the sharp ends of strings when re-stringing....can you imagine taking a buck knife to your mandolin ? I guess Bill figured he pretty much had the mandolin conquered so he didn't look at it the same as we might.

[f5loar]

Here is the proof positive that the Big Mon was a master carver with a pocket knife on mandolins. This photo shows him with pocket knife carving his initials into a fan's vintage F5 into the lower point bout. Photo taken Sept. 1966 at the 2nd Roanoke Fincastle Bluegrass Festival.
From the private achives of the BlueRock Cafe Museum in NC.

[AlanN]

Oh my

Monroe was silly with a knife, it seems. And that poor guy looking on, not quite sure what to do.

Tom, you say vintage....what dat mean?

[lenf12]

It looks like it could be a "vintage" ballpoint pen (given to WSM by his uncle) rather than a carving knife. I wouldn't let even ol' WSM do that to any of my mandolins.

Len B.
Clearwater, FL

[f5loar]

Well it could be an ink pen but it ain't cause I was there when he took out his little pen style pocket knife and started whittling and then I personally snapped the photo. If you blow up the photo you can see it's a little pocket knife. Monroe never left home without it.
Vintage means it was a real Gibson F5 pre 1966. Since it's got dots on it that would narrow it down to pre 1929. Back in '66 you didn't see any copies of the F5 around so it had to be the real deal and you can tell it's real too even with a factory pickguard. Has a black end pin too so it's old. No imports back then either. Now can anybody name the famous banjo picker that is looking on with sunglasses and total amazement at the butchering of a Gibson F5? Hint: He's from North Carolina in the Charlotte area.

[fredfrank]

I think the writing on the masking tape says: "Other side up".

[mandopete]

This photo shows him with pocket knife carving his initials into a fan's vintage F5 into the lower point bout.

Today we call that "distressing".

:)

[Brian Aldridge]

Terry Baucom?

[f5loar]

Good educated guess as we all know Terry was at least that big back then but not him. In fact back then Terry didn't know what a banjo was. He was just an unknown champion fiddler.

[AlanN]

C. E.?

[JEStanek]

I think Fred might be right. I went image mining and found this old black and white image. It looks like something written in ball point on a piece of masking tape...

http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=32&pictureid=1299

I magnified the inset image a bit to make it more clear. Good call, Fred.

Jamie

[fredfrank]

. Good call, Fred.

Jamie



Hey, when it calls for a smart-aleck remark, I'm your man.

[Ivan Kelsall]

I've watched the Bill Monroe tuition DVD's a LOT !. & i've never seen this 'whatever' on his Mandolin. It does look like an old piece of tape stuck there,i don't suppose Bill Monroe gave a hoot
about it - but it does beg one question,was the photo taken pre.or post the poker incident ?.
It still looks to be too rectangular to be 'finger wear' & i doubt that Bill Monroe played that high up the neck,even over all his years of playing,to produce wear like that anyway,
Saska

[grassrootphilosopher]

Now who was the banjo picker? Spill the beans, we´re nearing x-mas.

[grassrootphilosopher]

It took me a while to guess, but how about Kenny Ingram?

[swampstomper]

Olaf, I think you've got it! Sure looks like "Big K" as Rhonda calls him. He would be about the right age; he worked with Flatt in the early 70's.

I had first thought of Jim Mills but I believe he is too young.

[f5loar]

The photo is early 80's so it would be pre poker but post headstock repair first time. CE Ward was never that big. While Kenny I. is a good guess he was not from the Charlotte, NC area. Maybe the tag "famous" is throwing you. Back then if you cut one LP record you were considered locally "famous" even if it was to be the only record you cut. Outside of the Charlotte area I doubt anyone knew this banjo picker turned mandolin picker in later life.

[f5loar]

PS: After Darryl Wolfe gives his guess and it's wrong I'll tell who it is.

[grassrootphilosopher]

Okay, I´ll give it another shot, it´s Frank Ray.

[GTison]

I want to know who's mandolin that is. If it was carved in it should still be there. And if it's vintage perhaps Darryl Wolfe, would know, or have more pics.

[f5loar]

He might but I don't recall it being noted in any notes in the F5Journal.
Remember there are still Loar and Fern owners out there that only attend Bluegrass Festivals and then go back to their cave style living with no access to the outside world other than a mile long drop cord from a friend's house used to cook their food on and play their 8 track Bill Monroe tapes. These type personalities do not know about the F5 Journal and have not registared their vintage wares. It is likely they will die in their caves leaving no family relatives to claim their inheritance and all their worldly possessions will rot in their caves. Sad but true. So if you see some 80 year old guy walking around a festival holding a vintage 20's F5 and you see those "WSM" initials in the lower bout how about get that serial number.

[f5loar]

Before this gets lost in the downward shuffle of forgotten post I will give the name of the mystery banjo picker in the '66 Monroe knife carving demonstration on a vintage F5.
It is Jim Whitley of the Charlotte area band Chicken Hot Rod.
Jim passed away a few months ago. His love and playing of old time/bluegrass music continued until he died.