Mandolins and overalls

[pjlama]

I'm sorry but I need to know, what's the connection between overalls and playing mandolin?

[Crowder]

Two words: Mike Compton.

[pjlama]

But, why?

[JEStanek]

That's how he rolls. Mike's a real original guy. I would love to meet him and hang out. When I see someone in overalls with a t shirt and a mandolin, I think, "That guy like Mr. Compton."

Jamie

[Crowder]

But, why?
Oh, that? I dunno. I guess some guys like him enough to dress like him. Grown men, too. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[pjlama]

So that's really it? Mike Compton prefers overalls to pants, slacks, dungrees or jeans and out of adoration fans chose to wear overalls while engaged in mandolin activities, either participant or witness? That's kinda like finding out the meaning of life, 42.

[Paul Kotapish]

Mike wasn't the first bluegrass or old-time musician to wear overalls on a regular basis--it's been an alternative attire preference for many for decades. But wearing them has become a signature look for him, like they were for Stringbean years ago.

http://unashamedgospelbluegrass.com/resources/overalls_sm.jpg


http://s3.amazonaws.com/findagrave/photos/2001/222/akemandavidbio.jpg

[pjlama]

Now we're getting somewhere.

[RevRichard]

When Earl Scruggs hit the big time, banjo players noticed that he wore his banjo strap on his right shoulder. Pretty soon every banjo player who wanted to sound like Earl wore his banjo strap the same way. Finally someone asked Earl why he wore it that way. He replied that to put the strap on the other shoulder, he would have to take off his hat, and that would mess up his hair.

Sometimes the reason isn't what you think it is. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Jim]

Overalls are pretty darn comfortable.

[Mike Snyder]

No matter how sophisticated bluegrass has become, it's got something in common with bib overalls. Rural roots. I was awearin' bibbers before I ever heard of Mike Compton. He is, however, how I learned about the finest brand of bibs ever sewn (or riveted). Pointer Brand. Hard to find retail, but available via the world wide web. Yee Haw!

[allenhopkins]

Paul Prestopino, accompanist for Peter, Paul & Mary and apostle of the Strad-O-Lin, wears overalls in a variety of colors when he performs, and also wears colorful, mismatched socks (a different color on each foot). Plays beautifully on guitar, mandolin, banjo and recorder. And he's from New Jersey.

[Chris Biorkman]

Overalls are pretty darn comfortable.
So are sweatpants and Ugg boots, but that doesn't make it right. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Mike Snyder]

If it's good enough for Briscoe Darling, it's good enough for me.

[MikeEdgerton]

I know this will come as a shock but some of us have been wearing them since we were kids and that's a long time ago. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif

[Bigd18]

I see overalls on a daily basis. Its pretty common around here in SW VA. #Pointer's are not a novelty, its just everyday clothing. #I can go across town and get a pair of pointers (or carhardts, or liberty's) anytime, high back, low back, or new style. #I don't think Mike Compton is starting anything new. #On a side note, the more worn they are, the more comfortable.

And an additional side note. I remember when my dads eight track of Stringbean broke. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[pjlama]

I got you, overalls are fairly common for toddlers, I even used to wear them when I was a laborer so I wouldn't get dirt down my pants, but grown men playing music?

[Mike Snyder]

My dad grew up a dust bowl Okie poor as dirt. First time I came home in bibbers he gave me such a strange look. Far away and kinda sad. He had no wardrobe options when he was a kid. He wore bibs, and wore them until his ma couldn't patch 'em together any more. He wasn't happy to see the boy he sent off to college in them. Mandolin content; best reason for a tonegard, to keep your bib buttons from scratching your mando.

[Chris Biorkman]

I would think all the buttons would really do a number on a mandolin back.

[Mike Snyder]

What do you wear to a pickin', pj?

[pjlama]

Seriously, that's what I'm thinking. Lots of places to dent, ding and damage the instrument. I mean we're not talking banjos here, we're talking mandolins!

[pjlama]

t-shirt, pants optional.

[JamesPV]

Slightly off topic, but I've known more than one person who made an interesting use of the many pockets in a pair of overalls. They can be the basis of a bookkeeping system, with money received and money to be used for various purposes sequestered in designated pockets. I guess there could be mandolin content if you allocated a pocket to build up the fund for the next mando purchase, at that.

I haven't worn them for years, and when I did, keeping multiple sums of money straight was not a very pressing problem in my life. But I always admired the guys that used such a system, and being older and hard-working, they managed to have a lot more to keep track of than I did.

[mandroid]

Pete Townsend liked boiler suits.aka Coveralls.

[MikeEdgerton]

Some folks don't get real excited about what buttons and buckles do to mandolins, guitars, etc. If you're worried about the buttons get a tonegard and you have no worries. Overalls are just clothes, nothing special and no magic about. Compton dresses comfortably, if it's his schtick then so be it. He didn't invent the look but he may be the only mandolin player on the national scene that seems to wear them all the time. I wouldn't assume a mandolin player in overalls was trying to emulate anyone.

[Five]

A friend of mine who is a well known player and also buys and sells high end mandolins, used to keep a big roll in the top pocket of the bibs he wore so he could buy with cash to get the best deal. People think you look more down to earth in bibs.

[fred d]

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif I loved them when I worked constrution< Now it just seems to be an image at some of the jams I attend some dress with old time button shirts like the old time cowboys some wear vest even when it's hot!! cowboy hats boots (never been in dirt or near a cow ) drive high end 4by trucks with supper big tires some can't play worth a D### but debate the value of high priced instruments PEOPLE what do you expect\. There is a short time to be here and a long time to be gone http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[Fretbear]

As noted above, it has been around a long time. I have to give the prize for cool in not-so-modern times (70's) to wild-eyed Sam Bush with no shirt as Newgrass-Rebel-ComMando-In-Chief.
From a folklorist's point of view, it is retro-revisionism. WSM and His Bluegrass Boys always performed dressed impeccably (even after sleeping all night in a moving vehicle) to distance themselves from the corn-pone of the Opry's high-jinx and ragged-### hillbilly culture in general. Time came full circle to bring them back. Mike gets the prize for making them a bluegrass accessory.

[evanreilly]

Here is a shot of several mandolin players at a concert a few years ago. Bibbers predominate!
Mike and I have a suspicion that Bill Monroe wore Red Camel bibs.

[JimRichter]

It is too easy to draw the "dresses like Mike Compton" line.

I've worn bibs since a kid. I stopped wearing them when living in the city, but have gone back to wearing them once I moved back to the country (and also developed a gut in my advancing age).

Except for my work as a supervisor at a metropolitan mental health clinic (which has strict dress codes), I wear my bibs all the time. They're practical, comfortable, affordable. Additionally on my dad's side of the family were bib wearers because they were old fashioned farmers. I proudly wear my bibs because if they were good enough for my grandad (who I am named after), they are good enough for me.

I don't think Mike has lured people to wear bibs. I think he has made many guys who have worn bibs to feel comfortable wearing them more frequently. However, for me, my move out of the city and back to the joys of canning, raising chickens, a large garden, fishing, and hunting tempt me to wear the uniform of the traditional rural jim or jane.

PJ--I know you are a motorcycle guy. Isn't it a little weird for grown men to dress in leather chaps, black jeans, Harley T-Shirt, and a skull rag to ride a bike? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Photos of my bib heritage:

My grandpa and grandma: James and Luella Richter

[JimRichter]

family photo from around 1987 or so (I was already in college). The bib-overalled guys are my uncles Terry and Randy (my dad's younger brothers). They always wear bibs, even though they don't farm anymore.

[JimRichter]

Me and my boys at the Falls of the Ohio State Park from a couple years ago.

By the way, Mike says Pointers are the best. I disagree. I am a big fan of Key bibs (and Libertys when you could find them). They are easier to find, more affordable, and more durable. I had problems with any pair of Pointers I ever had (mainly with the hardware).

[devilsbox]

Mike Compton played last night in Maine wearing his bibs. A great show!

[Jim]

I hear tell some city folk wear jackets even in summer when it's hot!

[mandroid]

Dignified,.. No plumber's Butt cleavage.. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[pjlama]

PJ--I know you are a motorcycle guy. #Isn't it a little weird for grown men to dress in leather chaps, black jeans, Harley T-Shirt, and a skull rag to ride a bike? #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Great pics Jim. I'm the other kind of motorcycle guy, the power ranger type, here I am in action

[woodwizard]

Nothin' wrong with bib overalls ... My Great Grandpa and his brother dug them as you can see in this old picture. My Great Grandpa's on the left. Looks like his brother had on his Sunday best for the picture.

[pjlama]

FWIW all this talk of overalls has me thinking about getting some, I sure loved them when I worked in the dirt, maybe I'm being bibwashed. The pics on this tread are getting fun too.

[frankenstein]

hey surfing's about wearing rubber, motor cycles are about wearing leather, mandolins are about wearing overalls.. i'd better get some... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[farmerjones]

Me on the back page of The Iowan mag.

http://elwood.longlines.com/~jonz/pix/Steve_01.jpg

That's everyday. Sweatshirt if it's cooler. To me, bibs are all about function. If you can't buy it at the feed store, you don't need it. And yes, there's pliers and a pocket knife too.

[RevRichard]

I think it's interesting that Bill Monroe, the guy who started it all, was a pretty snappy dresser, and had the Blue Grass Boys dress up as well.

[John Flynn]

I went to a Mike Compton workshop some time ago. Two guys showed up dressed just like Mike: Coveralls, T-shirts and ballcaps. Both of them also had Gilchrist F5's. One irony was that Mike, of course, is pretty lean, whereas these guys were BIG. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but given the matching outfits, it just looked funny. Some other ironies were that they had a hard time keeping up with the workshop, even though it was obvious they had been to Compton workshops before, and they acted like Mike was an 'ol buddy-pal of thiers, while Mike made it seem that the feeling was not completely mutual. This whole discussion of coveralls brought that incident to mind.

[Ken Olmstead]

Overalls are slimming! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[tree]

I always liked the style of this guy with overalls:

[kudzugypsy]

Mike C was in no way the originator of the MODERN bib look - the REAL source of the whole overall fashion statement was banjo player Larry Perkins, then they were adapted by mandolinist Tony Williamson. during the 80's/90's you never saw these guys out of bibs. i think Mike got the idea from Larry Perkins when they were playing with John Hartford. i find they are the most practical piece of clothing ever invented and i rarely wear them anymore due to the comparison to MC, he has sort of cornered that look. Tony Williamson doesnt wear them anymore because people thought he was coping MC - he is now favoring colorful hawaiian shirts!
its funny how you need *the look* to compliment your act - be it Hartfords Derby hat, or MC's bibs, Sams wild bush hairdo, Grismans Garcia look or Stewart Duncans wild shirts - i need to get me a catchy fashion statement

[mandopete]

I thought Compton got the idea from John Hartford.

[mandopete]

i need to get me a catchy fashion statement
Like this!

[kudzugypsy]

i think Larry Perkins got the idea from Bashful Brother Oswald, who wore them his entire life / career - but Larry took it the full measure for maximum impact - he went barefoot too!

Larry tells the story of going to buy a new car in the mid 80's and wearing overalls and probably flip-flops and he couldnt get anyone to even talk to him - and he said in his bib pockets was cash money to buy the car outright.

[mandomurph]

I would wear overalls too if it would help me play like Mike Compton!

[Nick Alberty]

It's kind of like Wrangler cowboy cut jeans and boots around here. That's usually the going style for alot of musicians.

What I don't like is when bluegrass musicians don't even bother to dress up at all. Some wear shorst and hawaiin shirts with ball caps.....that doesn't look good to me personally.

[blacksmith]

Overalls Rule!! Lots of ventilation, room to scratch. What more could you want?

[TonyP]

Coming from two farm families, who's parents were the first to leave the farm, bibs were work clothes. Once work was done, they changed out. I suspect it was my grandma's that had that say, not them. I wore painter's bibs for work and they were the stuff. You could carry a whole tool box worth of stuff and a hammer. If not for them shoulder straps, they would have been down around my heels.
Out here it's so hot, bibs are out of the question for a majority of the year. And yeah, I'm one of those guys who don't look right on stage. I've got my nice hiking shorts(great pockets ala bibs) and some kind of cotton shirt. Hawaiian with either fish or instruments are my favorite. And some kind of good shoe that supports me through the hours of work it takes to put on a gig. We've played when it was 112deg, and out in the direct sun.
Bottom line, everybody keeps saying, "music should be fun", but them make you wear something that isn't fun? Fun = comfort in my book. If I'm comfortable, I feel better,and play better. Mr. Compton looks comfortable when he's playing, it really comes off. Whether he's making a statement or not, dunno.
Like someone's tag line says, be yourself, everybody else is taken. And since I'm practical, my attire reflects that. I guess that is some kind of statement http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[salleyann]

A lot of us were wearing overalls when Mr. Compton was still sporting a ponytail.

[JeffD]

Overalls are in vogue in old timey music as well, and its not uncommon in banjo culture.

Aim at me now, as I become a target...

I think its ridiculous. I give MC leeway, of course, because if you can play that good you get to wear what ever you want. And if you come from farm folk and it bacame a kind of normal casual wear, OK, I'll by that.

But I refuse. Its an affectation, like wearing a miners helmet and light in order to sing coal mining songs. I have too many friends who wear bib overalls every day for the hard dirty work they do, and the only calluses I have are on the finger tips of my left hand. Similarly, a lot more folks drive trucks than have any reason at all to own one.

Ready, aim, fire away.

[pjlama]

Wow, the only thing that could spice this up more would be CT in overalls.

[JimRichter]

I think its ridiculous. I give MC leeway, of course, because if you can play that good you get to wear what ever you want. And if you come from farm folk and it bacame a kind of normal casual wear, OK, I'll by that.

But I refuse. Its an affectation, like wearing a miners helmet and light in order to sing coal mining songs. I have too many friends who wear bib overalls every day for the hard dirty work they do, and the only calluses I have are on the finger tips of my left hand. Similarly, a lot more folks drive trucks than have any reason at all to own one.

Ready, aim, fire away.
Fire away? I forgot to pack my pistol in my bibs.

Truthfully, why do people wear what they do? Why do we buy what we do?

There are more people with guitars than play them.

There are more people wearing jeans than do manual labor (where did the jean start out anyway? It certainly wasn't considered appropos outside of work)

Wouldn't a pair of JC Penny sandals suffice instead of a expensive pair of Birkenstocks?

Really, the thread is a little ridiculous. I think generalizations that have been made and the elevating of Mike Compton to guru status are silly.

I tried to explain my piece as to why I wear them. Sure, I like Mike Compton, but not enough to become a silly twin.

I wear them --as do many others--because I do. Nuff said.

Actually, what I think is silly, are the number of photos I see on the MandolinCafe of guys/gals playing mandolin and wearing the ubiquitous MandolinCafe T-shirt. I have one too, but don't feel like I have to wear it anytime I'm having a picture taken of me with mandolin in hand.

JIm

[Bill Snyder]

I appologize to John Flynn for correcting him. Not only was he correct it was not a matter worth be corrected.

[Ken Berner]

I don't feel the need to emulate anyone, musically or sartorially speaking. I don't wear overalls on a regular basis, but I have worn them out of need ('coonhunting, etc.) and for yard-work comfort. I prefer Carhartt brand since 1974, but would probably be ostracized by the mandolin community because they are not blue denim. I'll wear 'em when I damn well please, whether picking mandolin or playing clawhammer banjo!

[John Flynn]

FWIW coveralls and overalls are not the same thing at all. Coveralls are just that. They cover everything and you do not need a shirt. Overalls have the straps that go over the shoulders and while not everyone does you should wear a shirt under them.

From the Encarta Dictionary:

Overalls (plural noun) #
1. one-piece protective garment: a one-piece garment with long sleeves and pants worn to protect a worker's clothes from dirt or wear
2. work pants with bib: loose-fitting pants that have a bib and shoulder straps, originally worn over regular clothing as a protection from dirt and wear

So "overalls" can describe both kinds of garments. Where I came from, we similarly used "coveralls" to describe both kinds of garments. That's all I ever called them growing up. We were from a small town and didn't know any better. So sue us!

[woodwizard]

JinRichter quote: Actually, what I think is silly, are the number of photos I see on the MandolinCafe of guys/gals playing mandolin and wearing the ubiquitous MandolinCafe T-shirt. I have one too, but don't feel like I have to wear it anytime I'm having a picture taken of me with mandolin in hand.
***********************************
I ocassionally wear overalls and I ocassionally wear my mandolin cafe T-shirt. If someone snaps a pic when I'm playing my mando doesn't mean I wear either all the time or just to get a picture made. It really just accidentally happens ... silly or not and I'm pretty sure that's the way it goes with most pickers. When we sometimes share a pic like that here just means we're proud to show it off. (like a mandolincafe T for instance) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[BlueMountain]

Well, this is a pretty silly thread, but so what?

I used to wear overalls a lot when I was a teenager and a hippie wannabe, back in the early 70s, not that I can recall anyone else wearing them.

I can say this: if you have back problems, overalls are a very good choice. Belts often press against the very vertebra most likely to go bad, and after a big meal, that belt when you're sitting can get pretty tight. Even without a belt, tight pants at the waist can make your back hurt. A lesser reason is that the overalls can press in a well-balanced way against the small of your back when you bend over, providing support to your muscles (sort of like pressing your hand against your back when it hurts). In the late 19th century, there was actually a small movement to get rid of belts, on the theory that they were bad for backs (and they were at times). My maternal grandfather, for that reason, wore for most of his life pants with loose waists and suspenders or overalls. He thought they were healthier. Of course, it didn't help, as my grandmother hen-pecked him to death.

[jim_n_virginia]

What I don't like is when bluegrass musicians don't even bother to dress up at all. Some wear shorts and hawaiian shirts with ball caps.....that doesn't look good to me personally.
HEY I RESEMBLE THAT REMARK!!! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[Brandon Flynn]

Who cares what someone wears, as long as they're adequately clothed. I personally don't find overalls comfortable, but then again I haven't worn them since I was 4.:D

[Crowder]

While we're down this alley.....it seems like the "modern" bluegrass bands have developed a kind of uniform of their own (think Grascals, Mountain Heart, etc.). Trendy jeans and some sort of dark dress shirt, which is always untucked, unless you are in Grasstowne and then it's tucked in. :lol: That's what is acceptable these days, but it's as much of a costume as a Nudie suit or a ten-gallon hat.

My only expectation for a performing band is that they all be wearing long pants. Nobody wants to see an old white guy's legs, not even his wife or his mama. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[morristownmando]

I have been wearing overalls long before i picked up a mandolin and i think it is more of a appalachian or southern thing alot of people were i am from wear them.I think mandolins and overalls go together like bluegrass and moonshine and when it comes to overalls there is three brand names of quality pointer,liberty and my personal favorite CARHART.

[Cullowheekid]

Hello,
I've read that ol' Bill wore suits to add respectability to his music and to move away from the hillbilly stereotype.I played in a band in which the other three members wore overalls and beards halfway down their chests. I was slick shaved and wore no overalls and picked the mandolin. Further, I was born and raised in West Virginia. My wife and daughter and I live in the heart of the Southern Appalachians, and my wife was born and raised in the NC mountains in an area that did'nt get telephone service until the late sixties. Her suggestion was that the name of our band should have been "The Caricatures".
To each his own.E

[John Hill]

There's a whole thread about overalls?

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Overalls?

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http://www.therushforum.com/html/emoticons/bd.gif

[MikeEdgerton]

I think it's interesting that Bill Monroe, the guy who started it all, was a pretty snappy dresser, and had the Blue Grass Boys dress up as well.
The "guy that started it all" was simply doing what most professional musicians did in those days, dressing as well as the best dressed guy in the audience. In his world it was not an option to go the grunge route, he dressed that way because it was part what musicians did then. The dressed down professional musician really didn't come into play until much later. Look at the Rock stars from the 50's and 60's. They were still adhering to that concept.

[Laurence Firth]

Mike - wouldn't you agree though that the "dressing down" image was the mainstay for the Opry as a "country costume" for many of the performers? And if I'm not mistaken every Leadbelly and Big Bob Broonzy were known to wear overalls and "farm" costumes when performing even though their street attire was more urban. Its part of the effort to appear authentic country. I'm not saying that its a costume for everyone that wears them but many performers before and during Bill Monroe's time wore this type of country attire on stage.

[Mikey G]

I've seen a few mandolin players who've played wearing overalls, but I've never thought about it. Our bass player wears 'em a lot when he plays, but it kind of suits him. I've seen guys wearing them that couldn't get the buttons on the side buttoned up due to the spare tires they had hidden inside the overalls, and that's not a pretty sight.

[Potosimando]

When I was a growing up, I had to go to church every dog-gone Sunday. #And about every Sunday an older heavy-weight fellow who we called "Scratcher Helm" would sit mid-church with his hand comfortably inside his overalls, scratching away throughout the entire service (yeah, scratching way down there). #Odd habit old Scratcher Helm had, especially for church, but the overalls served him well for that purpose. #Whenever you'd see Scrather Helm in town, he would have on the same overalls and same arm/hand position.

So...now, whenever I see someone in Public in overalls I think of old Scratcher Helm, and it's not a flattering image to me personally...but only because of my youthful exposure to Mr. Helm and his persistent itch (or maybe I should say his veiled exposure to all of us). #He was indeed a down-to-earth farmer, and a heck of a nice guy...but still. #I guess he thought no one noticed--we did, God rest his soul.

[MikeEdgerton]

Mike - wouldn't you agree though that the "dressing down" image was the mainstay for the Opry as a "country costume" for many of the performers? And if I'm not mistaken every Leadbelly and Big Bob Broonzy were known to wear overalls and "farm" costumes when performing even though their street attire was more urban. Its part of the effort to appear authentic country. I'm not saying that its a costume for everyone that wears them but many performers before and during Bill Monroe's time wore this type of country attire on stage.
Actually no, I don't agree with that. Take a look at This google search of Leadbelly images. (http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=leadbelly&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi) See anything unusual here? It looks like the majority of the real Leadbelly pictures here show him in a suit. I have huge wide-angle images of the Opry stars on stage. You had a few that dressed down, the majority are dressed in suits and ties. I'll look for Big Bill (Bob) later but were talking traveling professional bands here that were playing concerts and gospel shows like Monroe. I still know guys that were of that same era that still dress as well as the best dressed members of the audience when they play.

Same search with Big Bill. (http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&q=big+bill+broonzy&btnG=Search+Images)

[mandopete]

What is bluegrass?

[morristownmando]

What is bluegrass?
Any of various grasses of the genus Poa, including many valuable lawn and pasture plants, such as Kentucky bluegrass

[MikeEdgerton]

The Grand Ol Opry in the 50's.

[mandopete]

Okay, but I don't see any cover-alls.

[MikeEdgerton]

That would be the point, the conversation has turned.

The Opry in the 30's.

[morristownmando]

Okay, but I don't see any cover-alls.
What has cover-alls got to do with anything thats been said in this thread?

[MikeEdgerton]

He's saying coveralls for overalls. A common misconception for those not familiar with the actual garments.

[Tom Gibson]

Mike - wouldn't you agree though that the "dressing down" image was the mainstay for the Opry as a "country costume" for many of the performers? And if I'm not mistaken every Leadbelly and Big Bob Broonzy were known to wear overalls and "farm" costumes when performing even though their street attire was more urban. Its part of the effort to appear authentic country. I'm not saying that its a costume for everyone that wears them but many performers before and during Bill Monroe's time wore this type of country attire on stage.
Actually no, I don't agree with that. Take a look at This google search of Leadbelly images. (http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=leadbelly&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi) See anything unusual here? It looks like the majority of the real Leadbelly pictures here show him in a suit. I have huge wide-angle images of the Opry stars on stage. You had a few that dressed down, the majority are dressed in suits and ties. I'll look for Big Bob later but were talking traveling professional bands here that were playing concerts and gospel shows like Monroe. I still know guys that were of that same era that still dress as well as the best dressed members of the audience when they play.

Same search with Big Bob. (http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&q=big+bob+broonzy&btnG=Search+Images)
The early Opry "powers" did, though, try to get its performers to put on the "hick" character, at least so a book of mine (The Grand Old Opry - The Making of an American Icon) tells me, and got them to dress & talk like hillbillies even when they weren't. Minnie Pearl (Sarah Colley, who my grandmother knew) was certainly not like the character she played. The book tells of groups like "Dr. Bate and His Augmented Orchestra" being renamed "Possum Hunters" and similar such changes, and there's at least one picture of a group in suits "as they were," then all hicked-out in hats and bonnets and such. (No overalls, though.) Actually, the woman in the picture is playing a sweet looking F5, I wonder what that cost her, and where it is now....

[JeffD]

A large guy in overalls looks like a life size teletubby. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[morristownmando]

I would have loved to live back when it was the real grand ole opry.

[MikeEdgerton]

OK, but the opry was primarily a radio show for most of the Monroe years. Keep that in mind. Look at the two pictures and think back to folks like Hank Williams and such. These guys dressed themselves up for the audience. I think you'll find that a part of the opry was always comedy and that those acts might have dressed down for that effect. Minnie Pearl enters into that category as well. The majority of the musical stars most likely held onto their polished image. Hee-haw comes much later and that's where you really start to see the hillbilly blacked out teeth take hold. Guys like Monroe and his contemporaries most likely didn't want to be seen in that same vein.

[Laurence Firth]

Actually no, I don't agree with that. Take a look at This google search of Leadbelly images. (http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=leadbelly&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi) See anything unusual here? It looks like the majority of the real Leadbelly pictures here show him in a suit. .

Mike - the majority do show Leadbelly in a suit but the others make my point. In these he is either shown in "work" outfits or prison outfit - both for their theatrical effect. I will have to do a search for the historical text (at my library) that makes this point about both Leadbelly and Big Bill and the "dress code" for the Opry, and will post it later. Both men actually hated dressing down but were instructed to by Lomax and John Hammon to wear (at various times in performance). Its actually a very interesting cultural identification signifier. The USA is very "country" identified and signals this identification via our love of "jeans" and "work shirts" as our casual attire even thought most people live in cities and have never lived in a rural environment. Even the Carter's were photographed in overalls and work attire in front of there home as a publicity shot. Not that they were not the real deal but even back in the early days of recording country music R. Peer knew who he was selling to and understood the value of making the connection to the intended audience. Jimmie Rodgers sometimes wore his "train breakman" and cowboy outfit for effect. But his normal attire was a dandy suit!

[mandopete]

He's saying coveralls for overalls. A common misconception for those not familiar with the actual garments.
What's the diff?

[morristownmando]

He's saying coveralls for overalls. A common misconception for those not familiar with the actual garments.
What's the diff?
Coveralls have sleeves and a zipper from the crotch to the neck and are usually not made of jean material they are used to put over top of clothes that u dont want to get dirty while you are working. Look totally different

[Potosimando]

"Overalls", on the other hand, is short for "Bib Overalls", and they have a bib extension from the waistline upwards, with plenty of access for immediate double-handed scratching, if one so desires (no interior scratching potential with the coveralls).

Both would be equally classy for performing in, although if a person performed in coveralls, he just wouldn't get no respect from nobody, no how--go figure. Maybe it's the denim.

[Mike Bunting]

Didn't Jimmy Martin live in those gas station coveralls?

[Bigd18]

i'd say it's a lot harder to buy a sequened suit than bibs.

[RevRichard]

Interesting that Bill Monroe, the guy who started it all, was a pretty snappy dresser and had the Blue Grass Boys looking pretty snappy, too--even String Bean.

[morristownmando]

Didn't Jimmy Martin live in those gas station coveralls?
Yes he most certainly did unless he was on stage.

[mandopete]

Dang, I always thought overalls and coveralls were the same thing. #I guess I thought of Overalls as a a brand like Kleenex or Dobro's.

Silly rabbit!

[mandopete]

Okay, but I don't see any cover-alls.
Okay, but I still don't see any overalls.

[pjlama]

Overalls -

[pjlama]

Coveralls-

[LateBloomer]

I can't believe no one has mentioned the Fairfield Four yet...... Bibs and Tux combo.... they are ready for anything. They sound great too!

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[adgefan]

Are y'all talking about dungarees?

[JEStanek]

My favorite thing about that picture is there are five of them. They do sound good though!

Jamie

[MikeEdgerton]

Interesting that Bill Monroe, the guy who started it all, was a pretty snappy dresser and had the Blue Grass Boys looking pretty snappy, too--even String Bean.
Is this Deja Vu all over again?

[garyblanchard]

Interesting discussion. I think that entertainers are just that - people who entertain. Part of that is selecting an image for yourself, something that people identify with you and, perhaps, your music. When I was doing old-time/good-time music, I wore a bowler, braces, and collarless shirts to give a sense of a time past. Now that I'm doing folk/rock/jam music I am more likely to be wearing jeans, tie-dye, or a shirt and jacket. This is not the way I dress in my daily life, but is great for creating a mood. (I'd look pretty silly playing either type of music in khaki pants, pink button-down-collar shirt and bow-tie.)

If Mike Compton wants to wear bibs, that is fine by me. If others want to do the same, more power to them. As long as someone doesn't tell me how to dress, I'm cool. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[MikeEdgerton]

Are y'all talking about dungarees?
From Websters:

Dungaree

1: a heavy coarse durable cotton twill woven from colored yarns; specifically : blue denim
2 plural : clothes made usually of blue denim

In some corners bib overalls are described as dungarees, in others blue jeans are described as dungarees. If we use the plural dungarees definition as listed above a skirt or jacket made from blue denim would be dungarees as well.

[Hammrn]

I suppose cowboy hats are another thread?

[MikeEdgerton]

Cowboy hats have been discussed a few times.

[blacksmith]

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but the other advantage of overalls is no buckle rash on your mando. Oh, and remind me not to shake hands with Mr. Helm. Eeeeuuwww!!

[MikeEdgerton]

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but the other advantage of overalls is no buckle rash on your mando.

It was mentioned early in the thread that the buttons could cause the same sort of rash.

[Nelson Peddycoart]

It might be a regional thing, too. I grew up in rural Alabama, where overalls are very common among certain folks. When I was in high school (1978-1982), overalls with long john tops were in fashion.

Anyway, it probably helps to remember that before Bill Monroe, many string band/rural/country music (call them what you want) did not make any effort to separate their performance attire from the attire of the people from which the music came (an for whom it was performed).

Bill Monroe insisted on the riding pants, hats, etc early on, then the more western look as a means of gaining respect for his type of music.

I take Mike's wearing of overalls as sort of a purists' tipping of the hat to the origins of the music and as a statement that the music was played under shade trees long before the business of music was hatched.

[TonyP]

I sure like the statement that they went for dressing like the best dressed person in the audience.

In that case my walking shorts and Hawaiian shirts makes me one of the best dressed there!

We have a guy in the band who insists we all wear long pants, mainly because he's soooo hairy, he would scare the yungin's. He also doesn't set up the system and is our main PR person.

When it's been brought up on stage, I just say I can't afford the rest of my pants, working in a bluegrass band! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[MikeEdgerton]

In that case my walking shorts and Hawaiian shirts makes me one of the best dressed there!
So you've achieved the goal. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[JimRichter]

When I turned 35, I swore I'd never wear shorts in public again. Short pants really are for youngin's or guys who really are in shape. An out of shape guy in shorts--to me--tends to look like an overgrown toddler.

My wife is Latina (Mexican-American, 1st generation native born). We were in Mexico once and I was 25 or so wearing my typical post-college-twenty-something-look-at-me-I'm-young-and-spry-in -my-Eddie-Bauer-shorts-and-Reeboks--and-white-T-shirt and pointed out to me that not a single Latino man there was wearing shorts. First, it's impractical in that blaring sun. Long pants, long sleeved shirts, and hats protect you much more in the sun. Second, and most importantly, traditional Latino (Mexican) men see shorts as boys clothing and something not dignified on a man.

Of course, some time ago I went back to wearing bibs, and if I'm not careful, can still look like an overgrown toddler.

Jim

[JEStanek]

Especially in bib shorts.
http://img.classiccloseouts.com/images_104/attributes_m/3BU05608.jpg

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Jamie

[Yooper-Al]

The first time I remember bibs and a mandolin were Homer and Jethro.... "Don't Be Cornfused" 45 RPM record jacket from Kellogs Corn Flakes. #I thought pickers who wore bibs were just relating to their fans, but maybe they were making fun of 'em.

Hey, PJ, I drive by your store 2 times a day. #Didn't know that was you. #I'll honk the next few times and I'll be wearin' my bibs!
Yooper-Al

[JimRichter]

Especially in bib shorts.
http://img.classiccloseouts.com/images_104/attributes_m/3BU05608.jpg

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Jamie
Hilarious. That, sir, is wit and comedic timing.

Jim

[pjlama]

The first time I remember bibs and a mandolin were Homer and Jethro.... "Don't Be Cornfused" 45 RPM record jacket from Kellogs Corn Flakes. #I thought pickers who wore bibs were just relating to their fans, but maybe they were making fun of 'em.

Hey, PJ, I drive by your store 2 times a day. #Didn't know that was you. #I'll honk the next few times and I'll be wearin' my bibs!
Yooper-Al
Stop in and say hi. I have some nice mandolins in the office.

[pjlama]

I still wear shorts and am 37 so I guess I'll need to start thinking about retiring them. Since there's been a fuss over this thread I decided as the antagonist I needed to walk a mile the bib wearing members shoes/bibs so I bought a set today. I'll go ahead and give them a work out over the next few days, you know pickin' and scratchin' and see how the other half lives. I'll be sure to report on any improvements in my playing and comfort. If you'd like I can do some pics and sound clips.

[Bill Snyder]

When I turned 35, I swore I'd never wear shorts in public again. #Short pants really are for youngin's or guys who really are in shape. #An out of shape guy in shorts--to me--tends to look like an overgrown toddler.
What's funny about that is I never wore shorts much until I was over 35. I am in shape - round IS a shape.
Actually I don't wear them out much except to walk the dogs in the neighborhood and if cared too much about what people thought about how I looked I would hold myself up in my room and never come out. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[JEStanek]

I have a pair of over'yalls I've had since 1995 (they're getting a bit snug. They are Buba brand Overy'alls. I got them for a Halloween costume inspired by a Dead Milkmen record I really liked. (http://www.amazon.com/Beelzebubba-Dead-Milkmen/dp/B000003BHO/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1217382959&sr=8-1) So I went as Beelzebubba. With my Virginia Tech Agriculture Department hat (with added horns and a pitchfork. I revisited the costume a couple years ago when my bride and I went to a party as Beelzebubba and Persephone (Per'-say- phone). That's good southern Greek Mythology. Being the only Southerners at this Yankee party we pulled it off nicely.

I'm a big fan of being comfortable and being who you are. I can't pull the overalls off. It looks wrong on me. I get them when they look right on some folks and lots of folks just look right in them. Rock on!

Jamie

[frankenstein]

very attractive..

[Mike Snyder]

Lookin' foreward to those pics pj. Warning, however; bibs can get real warm in your frontal area. I forsake them from some time in early June until a cool Sept. breeze blows through. Summer jammin' attire is shorts and Hawaii flowery shirts. And I AM a big ol' boy, but, as they say, "round is a shape." It's the worst thing about summer, giving up my bibbers. Imagine that, two round Snyders.

[delsbrother]

While I love Don Herron's aesthetic sense:

http://www.kandashokai.co.jp/crate/players/photo_herron.jpg




I prefer the radiation suit look myself:

http://www.80stees.com/images/products/Devo_Radiation_Suit.jpg

[Ted Eschliman]

When I turned 35, I swore I'd never wear shorts in public again. #Short pants really are for youngin's or guys who really are in shape. #An out of shape guy in shorts--to me--tends to look like an overgrown toddler.
Now there's a great topic for another thread, mandolins, mowing, and Dark Socks and Shorts (http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/431440/why_do_middle_aged_men_wear_black_socks.html), right Jamie?

[JEStanek]

Ted, the crowning element in that photo is the bald spot. #Gold! #I wonder if his lawn mower is broken?

Everyone has a purpose in this life, sometimes it just to serve as a warning to others. #That guy is being who he is! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Jamie

[man dough nollij]

#That guy is being who he is!
I'm all for individual freedom. Up to, but not including black socks with shorts! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[MikeEdgerton]

I can handle black socks with shorts as long as he's not wearing sandals with them.

[Clyde Clevenger]

I'm almost 60, still wear bibs and shorts, though rarely at the same time. Never been confused with a toddler or a woman.

[terrierguy]

What's wrong with sandles and black socks? That's big up here in the rainy Pacific Northwest (kidding BTW) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Clyde Clevenger]

What's wrong with sandles and black socks? That's big up here in the rainy Pacific Northwest (kidding BTW) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
One of the times my daughters would let me go out of the house. I thought it looked fine, black socks, brown sandles, blue shorts, what's the problem.

[mandopete]

Sandals & Socks Guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z59fQ12OR0A), you're one of us!

[Links]

[QUOTE]Larry tells the story of going to buy a new car in the mid 80's and wearing overalls and probably flip-flops and he couldnt get anyone to even talk to him - and he said in his bib pockets was cash money to buy the car outright.

If that's the case, I'm wearing bibs next time I go car shopping!

Great thread - personally I prefer a lime green leisure suit with white overstitching - preferably with a little barbecue sauce stain on the coat!

[frankenstein]

someone has great chance to sell OVERALLS in the classifieds right now.

[MikeEdgerton]

someone has great chance to sell OVERALLS in the classifieds right now.
I seriously doubt the ad would last more than a few hours. You really can't call them mandolin related.

[frankenstein]

what about a denim bib and brace overall mandolin string and pick holder with stitched on tone guard hook ?? ok that's it i'm buying a hawaii shirt.

[pjlama]

I think Hawaiian shirts are another thread, that's a whole other set of folks who have a difficult job of dressing appropriately.

[mandroid]

Pamela Anderson fills out a pair of Bib Overalls well .

[frankenstein]

didn't know pammy played the mandolin.

[Bill Snyder]

I think Hawaiian shirts are another thread, ...
And here it is. (http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=15;t=25647;hl=hawaiin+and+s hirt) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[pjlama]

Well I'll be, that was rather disturbing.

[woodwizard]

But the snappy dresser usually gets the gal

[frankenstein]

yeah ! but the guy in the other thread is sporting overalls and a hawaiian shirt at the same time.. WOW !

[fred d]

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif The new uniform will be Bicycle shorts aloha shirts black socks sandles and must be at least 200 plus pounds more if taler then 5ft 2in and paint the instruemt orange http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[MikeEdgerton]

yeah ! but the guy in the other thread is sporting overalls and a hawaiian shirt at the same time.. WOW !
OK, I confess, I do the Hawaiian shirt thing now and again but I'd never mix them.

[MikeEdgerton]

What's wrong with sandles and black socks? #That's big up here in the rainy Pacific Northwest (kidding BTW) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I'm an expatriated Oregonian, I never saw it growing up. I did see it after I moved to New Jersey http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif

[Paul Kotapish]

Sandals with wool socks was a popular mode of footwear--even in the full drizzle of winter--among a certain set of us bohemian types in Corvallis and Eugene in the '70s. I heard Utah Phillips describe the look of Willamette Valley women at that time as "hairy legs, and wooly socks, and Birkenstocks, and all."

[frankenstein]

i just realized that jeans were originally called " waist overalls " so i guess theres no gettin' ' round it.. jeans and a hawaiian shirt cover all the bases.. i can live with that. can't do the sandles though.. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[phiddlepicker]

The front pocket is great for keeping a flask of liquid "inspiration."

[pjlama]

Sorry to dig this tread back up but my wife took a pretty unflattering picture of me and I thought it would be a nice way to wrap things up. BTW this the only action these have seen in a month.

[mandoforme]

PJ, I had to look at the photo twice! #At first, I thought it was a photo of Mike Compton http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Capt. E]

By the way pjama, I have never thought of looping the strap end around the base of the neck, under the elevated fretboard !

[allenhopkins]

pjlama, like the Giants hat -- Super Bowl champs!

[hoffmannia2k7]

I'll be at the game tonight.

[Steve Ostrander]

I was going to ask if anyone knew what kind of overalls Monroe wore, but on second thought, I won't.

[Capt. E]

Wouldn't be surprised to learn Monroe never owned a pair in his life.

[Mandojulie]

I would imagine that Mr. Monroe wore a few pairs of overalls. #It was inexpensive clothing for rural boys. #No other article of clothing needed - they invented "commando". #

My Dad ran around like that in Summertime. #For school or colder weather he wore a shirt under them. #He complained that his Uncles would tie rocks in his shirttails to keep them tucked in.

[JimRichter]

I was going to ask if anyone knew what kind of overalls Monroe wore, but on second thought, I won't.
If I remember correctly, Red Camels.

There's an answer for every question.

[evanreilly]

Mike Compton and I discussed the theoretical" "What brand did WSM wear"?
We suppose they were Red Camels.
Red Camels were were made by Pointer, the L.C.King company, and distributed through the south by the Belk chain of retail stores