Pentatonic Scales

[Steve Cat]

Any place on-line I can find patterns for pentatonic scales. I did a google search and didn't find much and checked here also.

Thanks

[mmukav]

I don't know about on-line sources but Niles Hokkanen has a great book on pentatonic scales for the mandolin. There are scales in different keys and also play along exercises. You can get it through Elderly Instruments and I'm sure lots of other stores. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Chris Baird]

There is a program that the author, A.J. Pyka, released here called chordbase. It has all the scales in it and more. I can't remember how to download it now. Maybe someone else does?

[cam]

Having turned to mando not so long ago after playing guitar for years, I was also looking for a source for pentatonic scales for mando. I reckon it's a much more useful exercise to map them out yourself though.Trying to play pentatonic/blues scales on mando has revealed how dependent I have been on pattern playing on the guitar. Because pentatonics sit so nicely on the guitar you can learn the five basic positions fairly quickly and them transpose them really easily without a thought about the notes that are being played. Of course the same can happen on mando, but I'm finding it useful to learn my pents again..

[RobP]

Check out this link:

Mandolin Solo Dial (http://www.musicdials.com/msolo.html)

This is a nice pentatonic pattern dial where you can turn the dial and change the key. #I have one-- its a nice visual aid. #They also sell a backup CD so you can practice against some chord progressions.

Cheers,

Rob

[Rich]

Let me descibe the theory as I know it so far and maybe others can add what they know. Then you won't have to buy a book!

There are 12 notes in all- all the keys of the piano, all the notes of the mandolin from low "G" (open low string) to the next "G" note(5th fret second string). If you count each 12 notes 1-12 you have
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
G Ab A Bb B C C# D Eb E F F#

the penatonic scale as I know it would be notes
1 4 5 8 11 sometimes also 7

now this is for the key of G. To discover the same scale for different keys- they will be the new notes associated with the same numbers, but starting with a different letter. Just move the letters back in forth but maintian the order, so "1" is the key note you want.

Hope this helps

[ChrisWallace]

Ahhhh...the dreaded world of music theory!! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Rich, I could be wrong, but your explanation of the pentatonic scale seems to be more along the lines of a minor penta. scale. I believe that a major penta. scale is comprised of all the notes of the diatonic scale w/ the exception of the 4th & 7th degrees (generally considered to be the most dissonant). So, in the key of G, the major penta. scale would be G, A, B, D & E.

But I could be wrong (it certainly wouldn't be the first time)...

[Rich]

Yes, I described the minor pentatonic - or I tried at least. Thanks for the clarrification.

[tiltman]

I would second Hokanen's book - great resource for an intermediate player.
Kirk

[duuuude]

Ya could just use the old "number of frets up from the root" method:

Major Penta: 2-2-3-2-3
Minor Penta: 3-2-2-3-2
Blues Scale: 3-2-1-1-3-2

That way you always know where yer goin when ya go to move it around.
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[thistle3585]

Mandozine.com has pentatonic scales in their excercise section of tabledit files. www.mandozine.com
And here is a site that gives the basics on it. Don't let the guitar in the address fool you. It is based around a mandolin study. http://www.free-guitar-tablature.com/p1.html
Then you can get a book called MUSIC THEORY FOR MODERN MANDOLIN by Thomas P. Ohmsen which has lots of scales and arpeggios.

[John Zimm]

Duuude-

Please pardon my ignorance, but could you explain the "number of frets up from the root" method? I'd appreciate knowing how to work this, but for some reason my little mind can't figure out where to fret just now. Maybe I should wait until tomorrow. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

-John.

[duuuude]

Sure, ya start at the root note, then move up the desiganted number of frets to the next note in the scale. Like for a major scale: root-2-2-1-2-2-2-1(root) will contain all notes in the major scale, root-to-root.

Now you most likely won't be staying on the same string course so you will have to figure out which fret to move to on the next course but that shouldn't be too hard.

I forget where I first found this but it sure made things easier for me when finding scale patterns all over the neck, maybe it'll help someone else as well.
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[Damnation Gulch]

Anyone know where I can get a book of exotic scales? Stuff like Hungarian or Japanese?

[WJF]

Please forgive the shameless totally self serving plug here ... DON't buy the book if you don't think it will help you but ....

I wrote a book for Alfred publishing released earlier this year that covers Pentatonics in pretty exhaustive detail, along with all the modes, blues scales, whole tone scales ... virtually every type of scale you can imagine with the possible exception of some of the "exotic scales" (not likely that you'll run across many of these in Western music anyway). All scales are explained and illustrated with transposable patterns for playing them. In addition, there are sections devoted to chords (extended and altered chords) substituions, inversions, chord soloing, etc. Another section deals with the importance of Rhythm in music ... both the stright ahead "comping" that we frequently associate with the word "rhythm" and melodic rythm ... varying the rhythm of the pitches used in a melody to come up with a ton of variations. The book concludes with a section that puts it all together and illustrates a method of learning to improvise (sounds counterintuitive I know but it works).

The book is called "Mastering Mandolin" and you can find it any number of places including Elderly, National Guitar Workshop, Amazon, or Alfred themselves. You can see the chapter heading here ... http://out2lunch.lunarpages.com/mastering.htm

Again ... sorry for the shameless plug. I just thought I'd offer the book as a possible source of help not only on Pentatonics but a bunch of other stuff as well.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled message forum ... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Best,
Wayne

[lownote]

Steve Cat or anyone else, I have a pretty decent document (about 12 pages) which really lays out and explains scales. If anyone needs it let me know and I'll email it to you.

Lee

[Steve Cat]

I sure would appreciate it. I'm trying to transcribe a guitar book called "Pentatonic Kahncepts", by Steve Kahn. It allows Jazz morons like me to play some Jazz with the use of the pentatonic minor and dominant 7th pentatonic scales. Check my profile for address......thanks

[katje]

I too would love something that explains scales. I am driving myself crazy here cause I can't seem to figure out how to access member profiles to e-mail lownote...can anyone enlighten me??? I know it was a long weekend, but I tell you, my brain is definitely dormant! Thanks so much!

[Sellars]

I wrote a book for Alfred publishing released earlier this year that covers Pentatonics in pretty exhaustive detail, along with all the modes, blues scales, whole tone scales ... virtually every type of scale you can imagine with the possible exception of some of the "exotic scales" (not likely that you'll run across many of these in Western music anyway).
Is your book in standard notation, or in tabs as well?

[mandoanon]

The description at Elderly states it has note/tab. Should be good.

[mcmando]

duuuude's suggestion seems best to me-- works well, easy to remember, you can move it all over the fingerboard, and no book to buy!

Thanks duuuude!

[chirorehab]

While this isn't pentatonic scales, it has helped me learn major scales up & down the neck... Check this out Four Fingered Closed Position at Jazzmando.com (http://members.aol.com/teesch/FFCP.html)

Eric

[duuuude]

Wow, leave it to Ted, that rocks. Wonder why I've never stumbled over it before? Thanks
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[Flatpick]

A book called Mandolin Scales & Studies by Mel Bay. 150 pages of open and closed scale positions.

Flatpick

[pdlstl]

The pentatonic scale is the pure-dee ol', plain-vanilla G-run.

Click here to listen (http://www.teoria.com/reference/scales/12.htm)

BTW, the site above is a great place for learning lots of good therory. Every example has audio files so you hear the scale, interval, etc.

[RobP]

Oh yeah.. I forgot to mention the Niles Hokkanen book earlier too (Pentatonic Mandolin). #I especially like the accompanying CD, because a lot of the instructional material is spoken on the recording -- it's not just the musical examples. #Because I have a 6-month old baby in the house, I don't get as much hands-on mandolin time as I like, but I do get a 20 minute commute each way to listen on the truck CD player http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif #I have pulled out Pentatonic Mandolin again this week.

The Hokkanen book also tells a lot about how to apply the scales, and how to use different scale/chord combinations to get different sounds. #Tricks like these are NOT found in other "Here is a pentatonic scale" type material

The one missing in the Niles book is a visual layout of the scale patterns -- all of the examples are in notation/tab. #The Mandolin Solo Dial I referenced above fills in that gap by laying out the whole pentatonic scale visually across the fretboard.

Cheers,

Rob

[Pykos]

Attached image: A Minor Pentatonic (roots marked in red)

[mandocrucian]

The one missing in the Niles book is a visual layout of the scale patterns -- all of the examples are in notation/tab.

Thanks for the review. In regards to the lack of visual neck diagrams, I'm adding an appendix of 6 pages of scales in various open and closed positions to The Pentatonic Mandolin.

I've also just added an 8-page supplement of left-handed strung mandolin chords to my Guide To Mandolin Chords book.

Niles Hokkanen

[RobP]

Very cool Niles.

I have been working through The Pentatonic Mandolin and Bluegrass Up the Neck togther -- and they compelement one another well -- the Up the Neck book is very visual.

Is it possible for you to make that Pentatonic Appendix available to those of us who already own the book?

Thanks,

Rob

[duuuude]

Just got Niles' Chord and Pentatonic books over the weekend & gotta tell y'all they're very informative, easy to follow, and will keep you busy for awhile. I wasn't 10 pages into reviewing the first and was finding answers to long-nagging questions. No financial interest, just props where they're due, thanks Niles.
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