Tony Rice's split from DGQ

[jamman]

What led to Tony Rice leaving the DGQ? I've read comments from Dawg saying it needed to happen, but he could never fire Tony.

[Scotti Adams]

...Tony wanted to do his own thing...I dont think he wanted to be considered one of Dawgs pups...and the rest they say is history..

[AlanN]

Yep, and then the two old friends got together again officially (they never were very far apart) for Tone Poems 1, and when you think about it, who else but A. Rice could've done that record?

There's a show floating around of Grisman and Rice, just the bone and the Loar, Dec-2000 in Greensboro, NC. They make a big sound, those two old swamp dogs!

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

I heard a rumor that it happened when Grisman wanted to tour with Grapelli. Tony Didn't want to do that and, although there was some major tension already, that was the straw that broke the camels back. Can anyone refute or coroborate that.

[Scotti Adams]

Ive heard that also Mike

[BluegrassPhilfromFrance]

You're right. Tony was not willing to play strictly jazz with the late Stephane Grapelli but was more interested in developping his own style, related to dawg music but with his own personal touch. By the way, I love MAR WEST album ... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Scotti Adams]

.. The Mar West Lp is one of my all time favs....as is the song itself..

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

excellent album, and tune. I thought that album had less sound quality than his others.

Michael

[Spruce]

There's a great live show of the two of them playing the tunes from Tone Poems (complete with the instruments used on the recordings) from the Avalon Ballroom in SF....

Great stuff.....

I also have a recording of the Dawg and Tony sitting in with Grapelli's band at the Great American in SF, so Tony couldn't have been that reluctant to pick with Stephane...

[Tom C]

From a recording I have from a DGQ re-union, after jamming a hot pnemonia,
one of the guys (don't know who it was) says "That was fun! why'd ya have to go fire us?" Grisman's repsonse was that they all were involved in other things -musically and were busy.

[mandopete]

I also understand from the Wintergrass promoters that Tony and David will be performing as Tone Poems at Wintergrass in 2005.

What would be a real treat would be to see if they could get all of those instruments for the performance....

[Scotti Adams]

..yea..but arent you guys glad that T. did go out on his own?.....look at all the great music that probably wouldnt have had happened if he hadnt. Personally I think it was more of a battle of the wits....too much talent for one band...

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

I think the quintet with Tony Rice is the tightest acoustic band ever. The unit was interesting but wasn't as polished and lacked some of the drive. Still great but when tony left the DGQ there was a hole left in New Acoustic Music and i don't think it has ever been filled.

[SternART]

In the early DGQ days, I used to record the shows, mix some at the board & was DGQ archivist.......we used to call David & Tony the Gasoline Bros. Hearing them play duets backstage was always a treat, they went together like peanut butter & jelly or beer & peanuts, just one of those natural combinations. Lets not forget that Todd Phillips also left the DGQ fold at the same time. There was an offshoot band Ook' n'Em' (spelled differently for bout every gig) it was Tony, Todd, Mike & Darol. Basically the DGQ w/o Dawggie. When there wasn't DGQ gigs they would play their own brand of New Acoustic music.
They were writing their own tunes, played it a bit less structured on the arrangements, often played DGQ tunes at different tempos and really messed with the rhythm....they all knew exactly where the beat was but some played in front, others behind the beat & they called that push & pull "ook, n em" They would like go out of focus & return to sharp focus, but the groove was always there, just jazzed up a bit..... When someone played really outside they called that "zeit buba" All these guys were big into beebop jazz at the time, Grisman has a huge record collection & the other guys ate it up.......I think there were bidness issues as well as musical issues, that caused the split......but I figure they had just played Dawg's Rag enough times & maybe their ideas weren't always accepted by the Dawg, he arranged the tunes..... your solo was yours but they had it pretty worked out....after all it was The David Grisman Quintet not the New Acoustic Boys....Dawggie wrote the tunes, got the gigs, did the business etc....the others just showed up, rehersed endlessly & played great.....those guys rehersed hard & indeed were an incredible band, they all felt the energy & worked hard to develop the concept. I'm sure some of the other players ideas were in there, in the mix....and Grisman evolved and learned in the process too...just like some of the tunes started in the Great American Music Band era, pre DGQ, and Richard Greene's input in the evolution of Dawg music can't be overlooked & was a departure point for Darol. Several of the major Opus tunes of David's were hatched pre DGQ...... Mike & Darol lasted a few more years,after Tony & Todd went their own way... but that version of the DGQ, David, Tony, Todd, Mike & Darol were the trendsetters, New Acoustic Music started right there. It was really exciting hanging out in those days, many of us lived in Oakland & my art studio became a hangout, Todd built & repaired mandos in the back......some incredible jams happened, ahhhhh the good ol days. It has been really fun watching each of them take their careers & go with it. Tony & Todd just had the feel together, their strengths continued in the Tony Rice Unit. Mike, Darol & Todd later reunited some in the Montrose Band,and on numerous recording projects since...... Folks don't realize how smart all these fellas are, I think it was like a recipe, where all the ingrediants added up to more than the sum of the parts..... one and one and one and one and one added up to ten. I'll tell ya though as great as they all are..... those tunes, Grisman's compositions were equal to the talent in the band. Those tunes are Grisman's legacy. Like Bill Monroe.... Dawggie has an ear for talent & has attracted great musicians over the years, but the original compositions are a huge part in what made that band so special.

[Moose]

SternART.. ; Thank you for the above post! - Excellent description and insight into some GREAT talent.., and the music they have created and contributed. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[Scotti Adams]

..yes..thanks a million Art...I really appreciate your words...you witnessed some great stuff Im sure...wish I could have been that illusive fly on the wall back in them years...

[SternART]

I remember the time Sam Bush was in town, the Revival were playing in San Francisco & he came to my studio. Todd, Darol & Tony rounded out the jam. This was post Manzanita by a few years.......geeze what a fine night of pickin. I taped it & I think there is a bootleg of parts of it floating around out there....Sam would come by regularly when they passed thru the Bay Area.......I remember another time, a few years later him doing duets with Mike Marshall, among other tunes they played Russian Rag & nailed it to the wall. Hangin in those years "was" special & it is what made me a mando fanatic. I was just a beginner back in those days...hey...I'm still working on the tunes from that first DGQ album, those tunes are kinda hard to play, but great fun & not as impossible as most folks imagine they are... once you get into them, I wish more pickers knew them, stuff like EMD, 16-16, Blue Midnight, Dawg's Rag.....very cool chord progressions to blow over.....I was indeed the fly on the wall for a lot of great pickin'! It provided a lifetime of inspiration.

[Spruce]

"but that version of the DGQ, David, Tony, Todd, Mike & Darol were the trendsetters, New Acoustic Music started right there. "

Seconded....

I was living in Beserkely when that band was getting up and rolling, and, IMHO, I haven't seen a new acoustic band that touches that particular linup of the DGQ.

Todd on mando was the lynchpin. #His harmonic doubling on Dawg's melodies was a very underrated part of that music, and a technique that kinda got dropped by the wayside over the years not only in the DGQ, but in acoustic music in general.
#
Those 2 mandolins were locked in, and it really gave the music a drive that got lost as the music become 2 solo mandolinists in the later incarnations of that band....

[Darryl Wolfe]

right on Spruce...that music is timeless, and also has indoctrinated alot of people and friends into acoustic music who always said they disliked bluegrass. So it wasn't exactly Bluegrass....

[chirorehab]

SternART,

Wow! Thanks for the wonderful insight!

You were the fly on the wall!!!

What an experience for you...

Keep it coming...

Eric

[midmando]

[QUOTE]So it wasn't exactly Bluegrass....

Let's not start THAT again!http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif