Need some info please

[thehated78]

i need some help finding some info on this we found this after my grandma passed away and i really dont know much about it

[Folkmusician.com]

I believe this is called a "Harp Mandolin". #I have also heard them Called a Mandolin Lyre, but I am not sure this shape falls under Lyre. If I had to take a guess, I would say this is around 100 years old (just a guess).

I see that you have the bridge and tailpiece there and I do not see any cracks. If this is the case, it is at least worth stringing up (light strings
to be safe).

[JEStanek]

That's a nice looking harp mandolin. There are more examples of it to look at on Greg Miner's pages (http://www.minermusic.com/cc/whitexmas.htm) (explore there even more) and on this page (http://www.harpguitars.net/knutsen/dyermandolins.htm).

If your local luthier isn't comfortable working on it, A Mando Café member Dave in Tejas (http://davidnewtonguitars.squarespace.com/) has recently built one. If you start a conversation with him, I'm sure you can learn alot more about your grandmother's instrument. Is there a label that is still legible inside?

I bet with a little TLC you could get it playable and make some real classic sounds.

Jamie

[sunburst]

Does it have a label or name anywhere?
I suspect it was made by one or another of the Chicago manufacturers around the turn of the century...that's 19th to 20th century, possibly even the Larson brothers.
It doesn't look like it would need a whole lot of work, so I'd say it's worth getting it checked over and repaired if it needs it. It might not be much of a player (or, it might), but it sure would look interesting on the wall!

[billhay4]

It's certainly worth having someone look at. These are uncommon and fascinating instruments. Putting this one into playable condition would be a service.
Bill

[David Newton]

Hi thehated78
Kind of fuzzy, but at first glance looks like a Knutsen mandolin. Follow Jamie's advice and check out Gregg's pages, but even better, post it on the harp-guitar forum and get Gregg's opinion. He may already have it in the archives, if not, you'll be hailed as a treasure finder!
I've built TWO, Jamie, believe me, that is twice as many as one.<g>

[thehated78]

thanks guys we were just thinkin about throwing it out but im going to have it looked at you have been a lot of help

[JEStanek]

Sweet. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. You have a real gem there (evenif it's only in the rough).

Dave... You're more than twice the harp builder I am! Dave... tease us in this thread with the difference in sound between your harp mandolins and your navy model (flat top circular ones for those not in the Dave-know), please.

Jamie

[David Newton]

DO NOT throw that mandolin away "hated". Original instruments go for thousands, though mandolins less than guitars.

Thanks for the question Jamie. You must know that I will spout an endless blather about my instruments.

My Navy flat-tops have that "even", long-sustaining tone heard in Celtic stuff mainly. I've made an effort to make a strong mandolin, without going thin on the tone, and I'm happy with that. Experimenting with top woods have me wishing that I had a lot of wide-grain Redwood, it has a "woodier" tone than spruce.


The tops are arched by bending over 3 braces, three lighter braces rather than one big fat one that the thing will require. The Gibson Army-navy had hardly any bracing at all, thus the sunken nature of most of the ones I've seen. The depth of tone is controlled more or less by the depth of the body. I think I've found a happy medium.


The Harp-Mando has so much more body volume. The regular mando strings have a tone of greater "depth" or "hollow-ness" that you can't get with a normal sized mando body. The bass strings, which are tuned around and octave below the regular strings, makes it like having a guitar there to throw some notes in with. There is no standard tuning with the drones, you experiment, changing for each song, I guess.

[David Newton]

thehated78
Where are you located? There aren't too many people I would take it to for a good evaluation. A regular music store would be worthless. Are you in the Pac NW? Kerry Char is in Portland. You really should contact Gregg Miner, anything else is going to be a waste of time. He will answer your email quickly, especially if you add the little photo.

[thehated78]

ive been talkin to gregg and im in spokane right now but i live in south dakota and call me DJ and thanks you guys you have been a big help and i will try to get better pics of it and i will keep you up to date on it and i find out more on the history of it

[8ch(pl)]

I would take it to someone who can evaluate it's condition. It could have a loose soundboard brace, separated plate seams, who knows. Stringing it up and bringing it to tension could make it worse.

This is a very nice Harp-mandolin, probably worth at least $500 in playable condition. Any repair costs would be subtracted from this. I don't know how these sound, but they should be similar to a flat top of that era.

There should be a tailpiece cover that is bent 90 degrees, with a scalloped edge to the front and made to slide down on the tailpiece. The tailpiece is mouunted with 3 screws on the side, located at the opposite end from the headstock with it's tuners. You should see the screw holes.

It is likely made by Larson Brothers, Regal or possibly Lyon and Healey. Or better yet, like Dave in Tejas said, it could be by Knutsen, look for a label inside the sound hole.

The happiest ending for this is if you can have it made playable and learn to play it yourself.

[Gregg Miner]

Thanks for sending DJ my way folks. Yes, I've set him straight on maker (Knutsen, of course), value (gotta inspect it! - could be $250-2500 depending on a bunch of circumstances), and repair (Kerry Char choice #1).
Just a reminder, as a lot of folks were just taking wild guesses even in this day and age: anything remotely "harp" OR "lyre" related in appearance is most likely archived on Harpguitars.net.
Mando family is either here if Knutsen - http://www.harpguitars.net/knutsen/mandolins.htm
Here if Dyer/Larson - http://www.harpguitars.net/knutsen/dyermandolins.htm
and here if everything else - http://www.harpguitars.net/history/org/org-related.htm
Best,
Gregg Miner, the Harp Guitar Pope (yes, it's official)

[delsbrother]

That's definitely a Knutsen harp mando, and there are only around 30 known to exist. From the looks of the ornamentation, it could be a sister to one I just bought. Any photos of the sides and back?

You can trust Gregg to have the right info on current prices. Of course they're only "worth" as much as someone is willing to pay for one, especially given the sometimes horrible condition they are found in today. But IMO $500 is extremely underpriced for something so rare from an important maker. Elderly is selling AS IS Flatiron pancakes for more.

I would also say this was the original case, which is a nice addition.