story about Big Mon's mando

[Kirk Albrecht]

I have read - and seen some pix - that the Monroe Loar was vandalized and reconstructed. Can anyone tell me / us the story? When? Where? Who did the reconstruction? What did it need?

Thanks.

[Big Joe]

His mandolins...both loars...were nearly destroyed by a fireplace poker in the hands of an angry person. The instruments were brought into Gibson to Mr. Charlie Derrington's work bench. He had to seperate the pieces and catalog them one by one without further damaging the pieces. The next step was to place them back together one piece at a time and make new pieces to fit the missing ones. Once it was pieced back together the color had to be perfectly matched. It had to look as if it were sixty years old. Once finished and the instrument made playable and properly set up for MR. Bill it was given back to him. The same process occured for both Loars. Bill played the one most associated with him till he died and continued to write hundreds of great songs on it.

As stated above, Charlie Derrington, not General Manager of the Gibson Bluegrass Division and member extrodiare of this very cafe did the work. Hopefully this answers the pertinent parts of your questions. Thank you.

[John Flynn]

BigJoe:

Very interesting story! Thanks. I never knew he had two Loars. We have all followed the story of the famous mandolin. Question: What ever happened to the other Loar?

[Moose]

I would add - the story goes - that Chet Atkins presented or was present when the mandolin was returned to Mr. Monroe.... ; it's said that upon receiving it.., Mr. Monroe "...had tears in his eyes." - Go figure... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[Big Joe]

The second loar has been missing for at least ten years. There have been stories, but no one really knows. Also I mentioned Charlie was NOT the general Manager, where he really is. Must have been a fraudian slip http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif .

[Kirk Albrecht]

Thanks, Big Joe. I am kind of new to all this - though a lurker for a while - but I have heard about the destruction, yet never saw a photo of it in its distressed state. Charlie must have some gifted hands! That must have been one angry woman. I had read that Bill had a woman who was with him many years who was not his wife. I am wondering if this was her - or his wife. I am sure someone knows, though it's really not important to me. Glad it is fixed. Sure would be interesting to know where that other one went ...

Kirkola-
From the cafe main page, follow the link to the mandolin archive and you can find a photo of the damaged mandolin...

[Scotti Adams]

..and the story goes that Charlie couldnt quite get the color right on the top so he rubbed some dirt into it....not just any dirt...that good old Tenn. dirt...

[evanreilly]

Bill's other Loar F-5 will surface in Japan or in an auction at Skinner's for major $$$.

[EasyEd]

Hey All,

Is this "damaged" and repaired mando the ONE that is trying to be purchased for Rosine? I never woulda thought a "rebuilt" mando to be worth so much (No aspersions towards Mr Derringtons work intended!). I woulda thought it to be a different mando. And a general question. Are repaired mandos generally as good as undamaged? Or are they "damaged" goods? In most things I try to buy undamaged an repaired. Is it equally true for mandos? Or not?

Just Curious! -Ed-

[BigJoe]

Hey Ed...it depends upon what kind of repair was done and who did the repair. In this case it is not just the particular mandolin but the owner that made it special. It really is not that great of a loar. It suffered many bouts of poor care. Mr. Bill was a great player and was always kind to me, but he knew nothing of upkeep and cared less as long as he could get it to stay in tune and play. He would call our shop from time to time complaining about the way it sounded. Charlie would get him to finally bring it in. The fingerboard was caked with finger gunk and the strings had been way past dead for some time. We would clean it up, restring it, make sure the set up was right and he would be amazed at how great Charlie was. Charlie always told him he needed to change strings more often, but Bill could care less. As long as he could get a reasonable sound from it he just played it. There is a story about a fret falling out of his mandolin and rather than having it fixed he just played around the missing fret for a few years till he had some other work done. Proves two things. First, he was not very good about caring for his instrument. Secondly, his artistic skills were beyond belief to be able to play around a missing fret and still play the way he did.

The amazing thing was you had to know the mandolin was in the state it was to really know that substantial damage had been done to it. Charlie truly is the master at repair and his leadership has been a great thing to have. He teaches constantly and is always available when needed to oversee a problem. Not many General Managers have that ability. Part of the value of the mandolin is the story of the damage and repair also. The repair is almost as much a part of Mr. Bill's history as anything else.

[mandoryan]

Bill loaned his mandos out to people and kind of forgot about it. I wish I was a buddy of his back then. Too bad I was busy with being a tike. I also wonder who has that second Loar. I've heard it's not that great though. Rebuilt and all....

Now that Loar that's on the Post a picture of Your Loar......that's a different story alltogether. Minty mint.

I just finished the book "Can't You Hear Me Calling." Bill was quite the character...If you haven't read it, do it. It's a good look in to Bill and how he worked.

[GVD]

That must have been one angry woman. #I had read that Bill had a woman who was with him many years who was not his wife. #I am wondering if this was her - or his wife. #I am sure someone knows, though it's really not important to me.

Well it's purely speculation on my part but I believe I ended up living with that same woman a few years later. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

GVD

[AlanN]

At a workshop 10 years ago, Monroe showed up with his black driver on one side and the blonde poker-wielder on the other arm. He looked like an old stately, whiskered southern land baron..."Frankly, my dear, I don't give a ..."

[Darryl Wolfe]

Here is the other Loar that is missing. Photo taken while Charlie was finishing it up

[Darryl Wolfe]

Here's the main axe before and after

[Darryl Wolfe]

Here's the missing one before the damage

[Coy Wylie]

Great thread guys! Thanks especially for the pics. I'm now reading "The Monroe Reader." It is very different but eqaully good to "Can't You Hear Me Calling."

[Bluegrass Boy]

To me, big joe's post illustrates that sometime we can be a little too focused on our tools. Clearly the Big Mon was not, he was focused entirely on his music. That is as it should be.

[John Zimm]

This is a great thread. I am amazed when looking at the pictures of Charlie Derrington's repair job just what good work he seems to have done. I can't imagine the nerves a fellow might get working on such a famous instrument. Who could do that kind of damage to any mandolin?

-John.

[jom]

The question is WHY would someone do that kind of damage to any mandolin...and it wasn't "any" mandolin.

[Kirk Albrecht]

This sure is a great thread - thanks for all the contributions to my original query.

Perhaps that mandolin - so coveted by most all on this board - didn't mean too much to "Ms. Poker". If you're going to do someone damage, it will hurt most where the damage is most dear. I guess she knew that he loved that mando as much as anything, or perhaps it was in his hands when she decided to strike - maybe Big Mon used it in self-defense! That mando may have saved his life!

[f5joe]

Doggone Darryl, I take some NICE pictures! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[John Zimm]

The question is WHY would someone do that kind of damage to any mandolin...and it wasn't "any" mandolin.
I didn't mean to say that this was "any" mandolin; rather, I was wondering how anyone could damage a mandolin, any mandolin, like that. Crazy if you ask me.

-John.

[JD Cowles]

i agree with kirkola. the poker was very close to Bill and knew exactly how to hit him where it would hurt the most. you could surmise that it had to be a woman because he was known to have had some trouble with the fairer sex, and the mandos were stabbed and not smashed. i figure a fella would have smacked them on the fireplace like a tennis racket. there's a great photo out there somewhere of Bill hugging that mando like you would a small child after he got it back. great man, great stories.

[jom]

John, what I wrote didn't come out right...I know you didn't mean to say it wasn't "any" mandolin. I meant that he must've pissed someone off, and it was most likely an attack at Mr. Monroe, so that it might as well have been any object of *his* affection. It was crazy, but it makes you wonder what might have stoked the fire in the poker-holder...and I like the self-defense theory.

[Coy Wylie]

There are people hear who can answer in far greater detail than me but the story seems to be that WSM was away from home when an intruder came into the house, found both mandos, laid them at the base of the fireplace and had at them with the poker. Bill came in a little later to find them in shards.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

[Scotti Adams]

..thats how I heard it....took both mandos in pieces and splinters to Gibson..and the rest we know is history...

[Scotti Adams]

That must have been one angry woman. #I had read that Bill had a woman who was with him many years who was not his wife. #I am wondering if this was her - or his wife. #I am sure someone knows, though it's really not important to me.

Well it's purely speculation on my part but I believe I ended up living with that same woman a few years later. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

GVD
..me too...twice... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[evanreilly]

The attack on the two Loar mandolins occurred just before Bill & the BGB were to leave on a tour of the Northeast and Boston. #Bill drove off to lunch & the office and when he returned he found both instruments carefully laid out in front of the fireplace and beated into splinters with a fireplace poker. #He gathered all the pieces into a brown paper bag & went to see Charlie Derrington.
He told the story to a very hushed audience in Cambridge; he also was playing Charlie Derrington's F-5 on that tour.
Here is a picture of Bill playing Charlie's F-5 (clue: pickguard!!), take at the NightStage, Cambridge, MA, the first show he performed at after the Loars were vandalized.

[Scotti Adams]

..man if looks could kill...hes got the scowl on...huh?...ya gotta love it...

[onlyagibsonisgoodenuff]

Is that Kenny Baker playing bass?

[Charlie Derrington]

Nope. Tater Tate.

Another story (I'm tired of the other one #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif )

When I got my early '25, it was dead mint. I mean, not a scratch on it, and I babied that thing like you wouldn't believe.

I felt that Mon should have an old F-5 to play, so I lent him mine. When I returned his, he handed me mine. He was wearing that huge, sharp, pointy Bluegrass Boy belt buckle a whole lot during that time period. Well, I guess you-all can surmise the rest......

I turned my mando over after he handed it to me, and all of the finish on the back (about the size of the bottom of a coffee cup) was missing. My heart sank. What does a young nobody say to the Father of Bluegrass? How about nothing. I kept my mouth shut and frenched it back later. Oh well, live and learn.

Charlie

Charlie... Can I borrow your loar.. I got a gig Saturday at the Belt buckle convention in HotLanta http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Spruce]

The ultimate Distressed Model...

[mandomood]

Charlie D...that is one of the best stories I've heard...

you ought to gather some notes on some of those experiences, I know I'd enjoy reading thru them...

[GVD]

Great story Charlie. The anecdotes and pics that you, Big Joe, Evan, Darryl, Scotti, Willie, Moose and a bunch of others contribute to this board are what makes it so darn enjoyable. Keep em coming boys you're doing great.

GVD

[John Zimm]

That is a funny story Mr. Derrington. At least you could fix it yourself-not like the rest of us who would have to ship it somewhere. Just trying to look on the bright side. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif


John, what I wrote didn't come out right...I know you didn't mean to say it wasn't "any" mandolin. I meant that he must've pissed someone off, and it was most likely an attack at Mr. Monroe, so that it might as well have been any object of *his* affection. It was crazy, but it makes you wonder what might have stoked the fire in the poker-holder...and I like the self-defense theory.
Sorry about the confusion jom. I just wanted to clarify too that even the cheapest plywood mandolin deserves better treatment than that.

-John.

[GTison]

Bill did loan his mandolins out. I went to an old friends house to pick after I had moved to their town. I was picking my ol KM1000 and just learning to play good. She and her hubby are friends with Monroe.( or always said they were but I had doubted it) She goes back in the house and I see her comming down the hall with THE case. The one with bill's name on the side with the picture of the mandolin painted on it. the case was all in shambles and tied closed. I knew what that was. I said what in the world do you have and how'd you get that. she opened it up and there was a F5L. I believe the one gibson gave him when they repaired the headstock. I played it but was unimpressed with it's sound. But what did I know back then. Not long after that the poker incident happened. And Bill called needing the mandolin back. It was shipped (in that old case) and I understand broken in shipment. So it too was unusable. but just to see that old case gave me a chill.

I guess they really don't know who was the perpitrator of the vandalism. I've heard all kinds of names but most folks really don't know Bill, and don't know who he had made angry enough to do that. Could have been alot of folks. Some of that stuff in the smith book on monroe is jazzed up for the book I hear. So I would'nt take it as gospel.

[evanreilly]

Speaking of 'Loaners' lent to WSM, whose/what mandolin is shown in the 'later' MCA promo picture?? It is a Fern, with the pickguard, and a cork under the p'guard.