View Full Version : To honor stephane grappelli
Marveilleux http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif The Great Grappelli (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyGFuUVivjo)
duuuude
Dec-01-2006, 11:28am
Funny, I was just listening to Shine coming in to work, done by Grapelli & Grisman, one of the all-time fun tunes, IMWO.
JamesBryan
Dec-01-2006, 11:41am
Thanks for the post Alan -- I like how his emphasis and style change through the course of the tune. At the beginning he plays it polite, cute, and a little clever -- coming back into after the solos it he's charged and firy!
As always you gotta love the Martin Taylor 70's polyester leisure suit look. How come clothing styles change but the music doesn't? Jim
Ted Eschliman
Dec-01-2006, 12:21pm
As always you gotta love the Martin Taylor 70's polyester leisure suit look. #How come clothing styles change but the music doesn't?
Jim, you're kidding, right?
Surely, the polyester leisure suit look didn't really go out, did it??
AlanN
Dec-01-2006, 12:25pm
Yes, Jim, that man never seemed to age - we should all be so lucky.
He had 3 guitarists with him at that gig, reminiscent of his Hot Club days.
Santiago
Dec-01-2006, 8:48pm
When your play is that hot, it's always good to bring a spare guitarist or two in case you break one.
Bob Simmers
Dec-04-2006, 8:46am
That's great! The next time I get in a conversation about "dynamics" with someone I'll just tell them to listen to Grappelli.
I don't have any of his recordings. Any recommendations?
250sc
Dec-04-2006, 10:20am
There is a live recording with Grisman, Grappelli, Mark O'Conner, Mike Marshall and others that is amazing. Too bad they couldn't find any talent for that gig. ;-)
jmcgann
Dec-04-2006, 6:40pm
There is a live recording with Grisman, Grappelli, Mark O'Conner, Mike Marshall and others that is amazing. Too bad they couldn't find any talent for that gig. ;-)
I had the good fortune to be at the Berklee Performance Center gig in 1978 the album was partly drawn from...pure joy!
John, your a lucky man, plus you have the skills to learn from watching them.
I just started playing violin and spend a lot of time listening to this CD and Joe Craven's Django Latino in hopes that something might rub off on me.
Santiago
Dec-05-2006, 9:50am
Ahh. I was also at that 1978 concert at Berklee, but I didn't know it became an album. I went to Northeastern and lived around the corner. I remember just being totally awed by what could be done on a violin.
jmcgann
Dec-05-2006, 10:29am
I think it was called "Grisman and Grapelli Live"- LP only- the cover was from a California vineyard gig, but at least half was the BPC gig..
delsbrother
Dec-05-2006, 3:44pm
That album's the one that ends with the Gypsy medly (I believe also done on the King of the Gypsies soundtrack) right? That has one of my favorite Grappelli solos of all time in it... This album also has a VERY jazzy sounding Tiny Moore playing emando on one track.
John, we went over this on the Djangobooks forums, but I'm still trying to grasp this... Would the Dawg's playing on this album be considered an example of what GJ players DON'T like about mandolin players' "Bluegrass-ness"? I refer to the kind of over the top chopping sound on most of the tracks, and how most of Dawg's solos "bounce" around with endless sixteenth notes vs. Grappelli's more "swinging" sound. In contrast, Dawg's playing on the Gypsy medly at the end is much less BG or Dawg oriented, with more tremelo and ringing chords - sounds much better, IMO. Am I interpreting this correctly? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
jmcgann
Dec-05-2006, 4:14pm
At this point I totally disregard what the Gypsies would consider "correct". I'm not a Gypsy and will never be a Gypsy, so if I worry about 'purity' I'm wasting my time...you'd have to ask a real Gypsy what they might reject about Grisman or anyone else.
I'm an American Mongrel of Irish and Italian descent, so who knows http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
delsbrother
Dec-05-2006, 4:59pm
Most (if not all) of the comments on the other board were from non-Gypsies. The one that mystified me was that mando players were "welcome" to Gypsy jams only when they had the "Bluegrass beaten out of them." I countered with "well, what about Grisman, would he be welcome?" thinking about all his work with Grappelli. I got a fair amount of Dawg-bashing in response, which was puzzling because I thought he was someone to be emulated... Oh well, guess I have to form my own style after all. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
not huge into the gypsy thing, but some cool stuff. if you go down the list there is a grappelli and django- kinda funky- looks like its from an old b and w movie. they are playin in a living room and a whole bunch of guys are smoking cigars and playin cards wearing fedoras. excellent!http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/blues.gif
jmcgann
Dec-06-2006, 9:36am
Most (if not all) of the comments on the other board were from non-Gypsies. The one that mystified me was that mando players were "welcome" to Gypsy jams only when they had the "Bluegrass beaten out of them." I countered with "well, what about Grisman, would he be welcome?" thinking about all his work with Grappelli. I got a fair amount of Dawg-bashing in response, which was puzzling because I thought he was someone to be emulated...
You might know that Dawg recorded with Stephane Wrembel, a great French non-gypsy Django style guitarist. He also recorded and toured with that other Stephane fellow mentioned in the topic...
I guess my feeling is along the lines of this (and I posted a new topic at the Djangobooks.com mando forum): There is a difference between playing jazz on the mandolin, and playing mandolin on a jazz tune.
The vocabulary of non-classical "mandolin music" is fairly diatonic/blues based. Jazz is more chromatic, with modulating key centers. The two styles have their own idiosyncratic tendencies in melody, rhythmic concept, time feel, phrasing etc.
I would not be happy to play "like a bluegrass player" in a Gypsy Jazz setting, because it is a bit like taking a baseball bat onto a football field- they are both sports, but the games are played differently, with different "tools" and techniques.
I believe a good jazz solo (played on mandolin) will translate to other established jazz instruments such as horns, piano etc. because the musical content is what makes it jazz, not the instrument.
Among other styles, I love bluegrass, I love jazz, I love Irish music, and (cue Joan Jett) I love rock and roll. Each of them are specific dialects of music, and you have to be a polyglot to deal with them in their native settings. After all, nobody (usually) wants a shred metal guitarist sitting in on a Flatt and Scruggs tune, unless they can deal with the idiom... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
Funny, I always thought that the tune 'Steppin with Stephane', as recorded on the Dawg Grass/Jazz album, did not really feature Grappelli all that much. I need to re-listen, but I *thought* he was given short shrift on that number (seeing as it was titled). But, it's a fine tune, nonetheless.
Jean-Pierre WOOS
Dec-13-2006, 3:20pm
Gypsies are, above all, musicians and never refuse a "good" musician, whatever the style in which he plays. Grappelli was a Gadjo...
They limit rather instruments: it has to be instruments of wood and strings. The mandolin corresponds to the criteria, clarinet also, brass and saxophone will less cordially be welcome.
I have the chance to be side man for a Gypsy violonist, and I play only mandolin. For him, the most important thing is to preserve the "drive" of that music: how you hit the strings is important because it guaranteed the correct energy. And he appreciate the energy i learned playing bluegrass http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
You could believe that this way of playing limits the creativity. Really, it is necessary to re-think in its entirety the work of the right hand to keep at the same moment the down-up-down-up movement and the adequate emphasis on the right note. It is an enormous work to which I become attached since about two years and which begins today to give some interesting results...
Seth Austen
Dec-18-2006, 6:09pm
A few weeks ago I rented the Grappelli Life in Jazz DVD, and have recently been going back and listening to his recordings from various stages of his career including the live set with Grisman. I just love his gorgeous tone and invention in his solos.
Seth