Damaged from upgrade work....

Well..i'm in need of a little community advice. I just drove back from a disheartening experience w/a repairman. Seemed simple enough...change out some tuners etc. The guy put four dings in the headstock of a new instrument and then denied any responsibility. Said he "noticed that too" when he started the work. This is a lovely brand spank'in new instrument. i'm not an especially confrontational person. i did "ensure" him in no uncertain way that the damage wasn't there this morning when i brought the mando in for the work. Rather than completely lose my cool in front of my five year old son i paid the man and left w/an understanding that he would "like a chance to fix it" next week. Problem is when i got home i saw more damage and my wife "went thru the roof"....wants to cancel check....sue etc etc....ahh.............what would other folks do in a similar situation? Thanks folks.

[atetone]

At a bare minimum Dennis cancel that check!
Four dings sounds like he might have dropped a set of tuning gears on it.
Then cool down and consider your options. First thing to consider is if you even want that guy anywhere near your mandolin ever again. How did he propose to fix it anyway?
What other damage did you notice afterwards?
I feel for you on this. It has happened to me too.

[mandoJeremy]

I would personally fly through the roof, the clouds, the atmosphere, and the heavens but I do have a slight temper occasionally. I guess after I cooled off I would calmly talk to the owner of the store if it was a store or I would talk with the repairman and if no agreement was reached I would extremely lose my temper! Good luck.

Thanks guys...yeah it was one of the owners of a music store. i thought i could save myself a little time and trouble by not driving an 1 1/2 to Lawrence. The marks are more like a tiny screw driver that was being used to pry off the base of the tuners that were already on the instrument and the tool slipped into the headstock multiple times. I mean wouldn't you just freak'in stop yourself at some point...apologize and say i'm sorry but maybe i'm not the man for this job. i mean really...still thinking it over. i'm not big on legal action blah...blah...shame is these are nice folks who maybe were in a little over their heads.

[futrconslr]

they should have told you they couldnt do the work instead of doing it on the chance they could do it right in an effort to make a buck. I would tell the guy there was no way in hell I was going to let him work on my instrument....then take it to someone who could appraise it with the damage and charge the repair guy the difference. If he doesnt pay you, depending on the amount, sue him.

[Jaded]

I think i'd find out how much it would cost to repair the damage he caused and ask him to pay for someone else to repair it.

[Crowder]

"Ugh".

Thanks folks.

[ourgang]

I don't know what the guy charged you for doing the work, but most banks charge $10 - $20 for stop payment. Most of the up-grade work on the mando can be done "at home". Changing out the tuners is no big deal, 8 or 10 screws and a re-string. Replacing the tail piece is the same except only 3 screws. Since there is no ideal spot for bridge placement, all mandos are pretty much different, you can do that yourself. Except for neck resets, crack repair and fret jobs, most stuff can be done yourself.

I do think that it is a shame that a repair person would not own up to his blunders, but anymore, the people in the stores are more salesmen than anything or they would rather re-wire a pickup. At any rate, you are probably stuck unless you want to persue small claims. Good Luck and consider it a learning experience.

[MrSrubas]

Write a nasty letter, mentioning the "better buisness buerau" (spelling?)
the other thing is that you need to let everyone in the whole world know the guy is a crook. save the next guy's mandy.
I don't know if you can cancel the check, unless you have somekind of writen agreement gurrenteeing his handy work, you might just be out of luck. he might even be able to pursue legal action if you do (cancel it). that would suck worse, being fined, and having a dinged-up mandy.
good luck. sorry for your loss.

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

The thing is, can you prove the damage weren't already there. Without pictures it would be hard to prove. Even if people saw it not long before you took it. Same thing happened to me and a guitar. I got taken advantage of and had no real recourse.

[John Flynn]

I have posted my displeasure about repair work on this message board and named names. I won't go into details of my personal situation, because I consider it old news. But suffice it to say that it got the attention of the responsible party in a major way. The resulting confrontation was a bit tense, but it had the desired effect. Abusive businesses can only keep going if abused customers keep quiet.

[prairiewind]

Dennis,

This is not a confrontational situation. You took an instrument to someone who presented themself as being able to do the work you requested and were willing to pay for, and they damaged your instrument. Either they make it right, or you take action as suggested by Mando Johnny. Name names and keep others from suffering the same fate.

[BigJoe]

You would be amazed at how much work we do in repair that had been repaired elsewhere to "save a few bucks" and then brought to us to fix properly. Occasionally we get someone who thinks we should redo the other guys work for free since they already paid once to have the work done. Oh well. It takes all kinds. When it comes to repair, many think they can do a job, but few are really good at it.

[Salty Dog]

I guess the moral of the story is that you have to be very careful who you allow to work on your axe. #I have also learned that it is well worth the 1 hour plus drive (each way) to Preble, NY to put my mandolins in the hands of a professional luthier (Rob MacBlane). #However, I had to ask a lot of questions to find this guy (he has a very small advertising budget). #I would suggest that questions be asked at festivals, etc. to find out who does (or does not) do good work in your area - word of mouth is powerful advertising (positive and negative). #As a footnote to OURGANG's post, sometimes upgrading to Schaller tuners requires enlarging the tuner post bushing holes. #Enlarging a previously drilled hole can be tricky but my luthier had a special bit constructed especially for that purpose. #The rule here is that a modification that is trivial for others will probably be much more complicated for your specific "do-it-yourself" job. #Most luthiers charge very reasonable prices for the work they do and I feel comfortable paying a competent professional.

[PCypert]

Hey,
Was this your new Sucek? If so, didn't you litter the place with photos recently. You should have proof that the marks weren't there before you took it in.
Paul

[jim simpson]

I have rented cars that had visible dings and dents. I had the agent write this on the rental agreement so that I couldn't be blamed for damage upon the return of the car. I believe the repair person should write up the condition of the insrument when brought in (noting any dings, dents, etc.) to both protect them and you. This might have protected you in this case. I believe this is something we should be able to initiate with any reputable establishment or luthier.

[Trip]

I hate the situation, but this is a good lesson for all of us....when I take my mando in for my fret job Im going to have the luthier(well respected)sign off on the condition and serial number of mine.....and maybe even document with photos

[sailaway]

PLEASE do NOT stop payment on a check without verifying what the local law is on this topic.(ask your local police station. ) In some states, tendering a check in payment for services, then stopping payment on it is a criminal offense. If you have the energy to fight this , you can get a qualified shop to write an estimate for the work necessary to repair your instrument, then file suit in small claims court to recover the amount of your check from the incompetent so-called repair person. But that is a lot of aggravation, and may not have a happy outcome for you if your local small claims court requires a witness from the qualified shop to appear in person to swear to the estimate.

[sailaway]

PLEASE do NOT stop payment on a check without verifying what the local law is on this topic.(ask your local police station. ) In some states, tendering a check in payment for services, then stopping payment on it is a criminal offense. If you have the energy to fight this , you can get a qualified shop to write an estimate for the work necessary to repair your instrument, then file suit in small claims court to recover the amount of your check from the incompetent so-called repair person. But that is a lot of aggravation, and may not have a happy outcome for you if your local small claims court requires a witness from the qualified shop to appear in person to swear to the estimate.

[sunburst]

I was going to say the same thing as sailaway. I was once asked to be sort of an expert witness for a small claimes case by a friend who had a very valuable guitar poorly repaired by a very reputable shop.
He made the mistake of stopping payment on the check, and as far as I know there has never been a resolution in his case.

[krishna]

Spare change, Look. I'm pretty suprised by all this talk of lawsuits and such. If your problem had happened up here in Canada,.....Man ,we just DON'T HAVE LAWSUITS like this! And when a suit actually happens it's about something REALLY important,like unlawfull death or a debilitating accident. No one talked about it ,but I take it to be JUST laquer? If it is, then it's a drag, BUT it should'nt be that difficult to get repaired. So now I'll tell you what I'd do. Bring BABY to a competant repair person.Get it repaired. Bring your wife with you, and go present this 'lying bastid doofus' with the bill. Now I'd make sure that the 2 of you were good and worked up before you went in, and direct him to this thread, to the alleged photos, (is it really only months old?) and point out you have had too much class to name him .Either you get satisfaction, or you will tell this message board his name. I would question whether he had his brand new apprentice 'lying bastid doofus' do the work. (Maybe that could be the back door for his pride.) It COULD BE ,that he did'nt know the damage was'nt there before because his apprentice did'nt tell him.. I prefer to always think the best of humans until proven otherwise. THAT is the more polite, Canadian way. EH?

[David M.]

Is it a NEW instrument with warranty to you? Didn't see the answer if it was written above.

A very incompetent Martin authorized repair guy in the quad cities did some simple work on my Martin D-35 which I have warranty on 'til I die. He screwed up alot of stuff and took 7 weeks to do so. One of these was messing up the lacquer in the top while he was replacing the pickguard (Martin doesn't guarantee finish). He used tape and left the tape on too long and it marred the finish. Ticked me off bad. He also took the liberty to ream out my bridge pin holes and dress my frets. He didn't inform me that all this stuff except the pickguard was warranty work and I shouldn't have to pay, plus I would NEVER let someone ream the bridge pin holes.

I wrote Martin and complained several times. Then wrote one last attempt naming the guy's name and ALL the bad stuff he did and how incompetent he is. Martin agreed to have the lacquer fixed by a better luthier and was concerned that this guy couldn't even change a pickguard.

So, report him to the mandolin company if you have warranty and see what they'll do. No warranty, you obviously can't do that.

[Peakbagr]

I would return to the store/shop and calmly ask what the shop intends to do to returm the mandolin to the condition it was in when you first brought it there. I ask them if they know about Mandolin Cafe and Commando and suggest that if they don't make good on the matter, you'll take it up publicly and with the resultant publicity and all that means.

[Michael Lewis]

Ya know, the damage is already done. Do you want 'them' trying to fix what they did? Albert Einstein said something like 'the same kind of thinking that got us into this mess isn't going to get us out'. If you are going to persue a legal path have the instrument appraised in it's current condition, and ask the shop to give you the difference between the appraisal and a new instrument. Otherwise think of all the energy and money it will take to get satisfaction. Like a lawyer once asked, "How much justice can you afford?". Give it a good hard think, and move ahead or move on with life. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[krishna]

Spare C , How long are we to wait for you to post and tell us what ended up happening?

[Bandersnatch Reverb]

As po'd as you are about it, there's not much you can do except try to warn others.

This is probably going to have to be a "life lesson" type of experience.

This sort of thing happens a lot, not only with instruments, but with all sorts of trades. The fellows who clean your carpet put a scratch on the wall when they move furniture. The guy who puts tinting on your vehicle windows puts a rub mark on the trim. A button comes off your coat when you take it to the dry cleaners.

While the matters are not trivial to the owners of the items damaged, you may find that even small claims court would, in fact, find the damage trivial. This is often considered when the type of damage is such that it may eventually occur with reasonable care in the normal use of the item - ie, normal wear and tear.

To win a case in court, you'd have to show that the value of the item was appreciably lessened, and have to show that the repairmans practices were negligent, that he failed to use reasonable care, perhaps that the damage was avoidable and substancially out of the ordinary that might occur if due dilligence was used in the care of the instrument. The law varies hugely on these types of matters, but in general - you gotta prove the damage in real term, and that the guy who did it was not using reasonable care.

Stopping payment is another problem - in many places, stopping payment for SERVICES is actually a felony (ie, punishable by a year or more in jail!). Services cannot be "returned" and so recieve special treatment when it comes to payment. Again, there's huge differences from state to state.

Be pissed. Be mad. Avoid the place. Tell others to avoid the place. That might be your only real recourse, I'm sorry to say.