Carved tops - Flat backs

[Mark Simcox]

Is it possible to combine a carved top and flat back? Has anyone done it? Why do you need a carved top and back? Any thoughts?

[Yonkle]

You need a carved back to get more space in the air chamber,hence more volume and for the wood to vibrate properly hence more tone, and i'm sure there are lots of other reasons a pro can tell you.

[August Watters]

The carved top-flat back is definitely unconventional -- but there is a history in the guitar world at least. Gibson made some of these way back, although the results were debatable, from what I've heard.

John Zeidler did make a carved top-flat back guitar, and the one I played was a cannon -- it had more sustain than a standard jazz guitar. John called it the "archtop" and suggested it was best suited to swing and Django-style playing. Although John has been gone for awhile, his website is still up:
http://zeidler.com/archtop.htm

Anyone know of a mandolin application of this design? I'd sure be curious to try one.

August W

[jim simpson]

There is a Jannish mandolin on Ebay now that is the reverse of that configuration. It has a flat top in the profile of the Gibson lump instead of a scroll design and has what is described as a slight carved back. I have seen an upright bass with a flat back and carved front.
Jim

[August Watters]

Hmmmm. . .I'm the Janish importer, and remember this mandolin -- it's not a carved back, but a flat piece that's been bent. It's a great sounding mandolin; the tone is between what you'd expect from a carved and flat-top mandolin. The lump scroll brings back bad memories for most folks though. . . .

Flat-back/carved top basses are common -- this is a German design.

August Watters
http://galleryofstrings.com

[wah]

I have an old Gibson which is most likely a 1934 A-00. It has an arched top with f-holes and a flat back. It has its' own sound. I like it for old blues and jug-band stuff.

Wayne

[John Zimm]

This has me wondering, what would you guys think of a carved back, flat top mandolin? The idea has interested me for some time.

-John.

[WoodyMcKenzie]

I believe citterns/octave mandolins that have carved tops typically have flat backs. I think you could make a perfectly fine mandolin this way as well.

Woody

[Bob DeVellis]

Weren't all the real Gibson mandolins (the ones made by Orville, that is) flat-backed?

[Mark Simcox]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I'm only just starting to build my first mandolin but it seems that everyone is building the same designs and it maybe that a small change to the conventional may have some mileage. I quite like the idea of carved back and flat top suggested by John (Buckley)

[Ken]

I also agree that some of the arched top citterns and octave mandolins have flat backs. The ones I've heard have sounded good, rich and responsive. Bob, the Orville made Gibsons did have a flat looking back, but it was carved, just no arch, up from the sides and then flat across.

Ken.

[John Zimm]

I quite like the idea of carved back and flat top suggested by John (Buckley)
If you decide to build one with a flat top and carved back let me know how it turns out. I am waiting to hone my building skills before I use an old fruit box to make a flat top, carved back mandolin. The wood I have if probably 75 years old, nicely quartersawn, and it rings really beautifully when tapped. I don't want to mess it up right now, so I will probably save it for my third or fourth attempt.

Good luck Mark.

-John.

[Martin Jonas]

A flat top and a gently curved back is an integral part of the Portuguese-type mandolin. Although the curvature of the back is created not through a carved back but through bent maple strips, more or less like a bowlback squashed flattish, it works out as much the same in terms of the shape of the sound chamber. They work well enough, with a warm, guitar-like sound (at least mine does).

Martin

[Spruce]

I recently played an instrument built by Paul Shippey (http://www.paulshippey.co.uk/rose_mandolin.htm) at a music shop in Oxford, England, with a carved top and flat back that sounded fine...
It was very influenced by a Gibson A, but with a flat back. #It was very reasonably priced, and had a nice ringing A-model tone...

[Mark Simcox]

Thanks again guys some good stuff. Martin, The John Troughton book that I am building from at the moment uses the back bending method you suggested. I essence the sound bars are carved to a slightly curved shape and when glued in place make the back look like its been carved.

[oldwave maker]

Built a couple of teardrop octave mandolins with colo engelmann spruce carved tops and braz rosewood flatbacks, worked well, I think Greg Schocket in boulder performs with one. my first watermelon mando had a carved spruce top and flat spruce back (!) I thought it sucked but scott mathis makes it sing, would be a good experiment for the next mandotasting....