Pac-rim? What does this mean?

[musical mama]

I'm sorry if this has been asked; I'm new here and although I've read and read and read, I've never seen what the term pac-rim means, though I've seen a lot of references to it. BTW, I have learned a lot in the last few days from y'all! Mind telling me what pac-rim means? I'm new at mandolin, but learning as fast as I can. Thanks!!

[SurebetVA]

It means an instrument that was made in the Pacific-rim, like Japan, Korea, China. Orinally Pac-Rim instruments were thought of as cheap and not of great quality but some brands have improved greatly in the last few years. Some people love them but I prefer American made now that I can finally afford it.

[musical mama]

Thanks for the answer, Jim. I guess right now I can't afford American made, but maybe what I have coming will sound / play ok.

[John Flynn]

An irony of the whole PacRim predjudice is that the term is being mis-used to describe those countries listed above. If you look up "Pacific Rim," most definitions include ALL countries that border the Pacific Ocean. In terms of economics, it is specifically the members of the Asian-Pacific Economic Cooperative (APEC). So the United States, Canada and Australia are actually "Pacific Rim" countries.

So Gibson, Apitius and Gilchrist, just to name a few, are actually PacRim mandos!

[JEStanek]

When I first heard Pac-Rim I also assumed Breedloves were in the group as they are on the Pacific coastal area as well!

I think everyone who owns a Pac-Rim (and Breedlove) should learn Ring-of-Fire in honor of their 8th grade Earth Science class in homage to the Pacific Ring of Fire of volcanic and earthquake activity.

Just as an FYI there are a couple of USA builders that make good mandos in the ~600-1000 dollar range. #Look into Morris, Glenn, and Mid Mo mandolins. #They may not be as flashy as some of the Asian imports but their reviews are very positive and you buy American, if that is a key consideration for you.


Jamie -Proud of his Eastman Pac Rim Mando!

[Greenmando]

So Gibson, Apitius and Gilchrist, just to name a few, are actually PacRim mandos!
Gibson being in Nashville seems to be closer to the Alantic, so I guess they should be called AlaRim mandos with that reasoning. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[JEStanek]

I thought their rims were maple!
Jamie

[SurebetVA]

I agree Pac-Rim is an inaccurate slang term. Technically it would have included Australian builders too and we know it is hardly ever used to include them.

I am not predjudiced againts the instruments as far as quality, but I wear pointer brand jeans made in Bristol, TN too. I have played a couple of "Pac-Rim" instruments that were pretty good, but to much of my money goes to China already. I tried to quit complaining about China becoming a greater power in the world than the US and started voting with my wallet. I guess you can say I'm just trying to live what I preach instead of doing so much preaching.

[otterly2k]

I think that the term "pac-rim" has become shorthand for relatively cheaply made, mass produced instruments. #It so happens that this work is happening in the countries mentioned above. #These manufacturers are prolific...turning out lots of instruments that then get slightly different finishing touches and marketed under a number of brand names. #The same instrument might be marketed as "Tyler Mountain" or "Trinity College" or "Gold Tone" or "Ashbury" ... depending on where and to whom it is being marketed. #

To be fair, there are relatively cheaply made, mass-produced instruments from other parts of the world. #There's just not as many of them on the market. AND, there are high quality hand-made instruments being made in many places other than US.

[Tim]

I'm not a professor (we have them on the board), but it seems to me that there are many words that have multiple meanings. #A definition is not sufficient, you have to verify that you have the correct definition for the context. #Using PacRim to describe mandolins made in Japan, Korea and China is not mis-using the term. #It is just using it in a different context.

[SurebetVA]

Otterly - you summed it up perfect.
Just my two cents I think the best quality mandolins not made in the US are probably coming from China (Eastman), Australia, Czech Republic, Great Britain. #That's just from what I have played or heard on here. #I think some of the Czech builders have really gotten a good reputation in the last few years. #Some of these builders are as good as anything you can buy made in the US depending on your preference in sound, etc.

I am sure I am missing some and I believe there are some bowl back builders in Germany and Italy but I don't know much about these styles.

Cheaply "built" mando's from other parts of the world - I can't think of any that are currently being sold in the US on a big scale, but I think I saw a thread about a cheaper Romanian made mandolin awhile back...Do you know of any other non Pacific Rim "Cheap made" mando's currently being sold in the US?

[otterly2k]

there was a thread recently about inexpensive Mexican instruments. And the Romanian made instruments are becoming more and more visible...especially if you watch for CBOMs

[JEStanek]

Perhaps we can become businessesqe and use terms like "challenges" instead of "failures" or "opportunities" instead of "more work for you" and refer to a poorly contructed mandolin as Wallhangolin, Badolin, Crapdolin, Ican'tbelieveIpayedforthisolin, Oopsolin, Knottypinepanelin, firewoodolin, 500trainedmonkeyswithinfintetimebuildaLoarolin, and my personal favorite.... The ebayregretolin.

Jamie -Who misses Sniglets.

[gnelson651]

and my personal favorite.... The ebayregretolin.

Jamie -Who misses Sniglets.
Hey, that was my first mandolin. Paid more for the S&H than the regretolin, otherwise known as a POSolin http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[musical mama]

So do you think that mandolin purchases from e-bay are usually bad experiences, rather than good? Or are you mostly referring to the ones they are selling for less than $100.00, esp. buy it now?

I must admit I bought my first one off of e-bay, and though it was noted that it was not a particular brand (supposedly handcrafted by an unnamed luthier around Nashville, TN.), and there was a split in the back (as was noted in the auction), I felt like I got a pretty nice mando. I bought it for a wall hanger, but decided a few weeks ago to play it. Thankfully, it stays in tune well, is fretted correctly, and is playable. I have just purchased and am waiting for an F4 Washburn M4SW mando, also an e-bay sale. Think I'll regret it?

[SurebetVA]

Anytime you buy on Ebay your taking a risk. I have a friend that has a Washburn that I like pretty good. It's not Weber (or Gibson or Collings, etc). but the action is easy and the sound is pretty good. It is a greater starter mandolin or backup mandolin. It also would be fine if a person did not want to invest that much into the hobby but wanted a playable instrument that sounded decent. I'm sure not all Washburn's are created equal and you probably won't know until it arrives whether your going to be happy with it. Good Luck

[musical mama]

I sure have appreciated all the input; thanks to everyone!

[otterly2k]

I think ebay experiences vary, but that the anonymity of such a large marketplace allows more leeway for people to rip each other off (whether intentionally or not). I prefer using the classified ads here, when possible.

that said, I think if you learn to ask a lot of specific questions, make sure you're satisfied with the answers, and can avoid getting swept up in the hype of the timed auction format, it is possible to get some very nice instruments on ebay.

I recently bought an Old Wave oval that way... I'm glad to say that it turned out to have been worth the risk.

[JEStanek]

My E-bay experiences were a mixed bag 2 good, 1 bad, 1 ugly. Cue up the Ennio Morricone. A Weber Sweet Pea and Johnson oval (good), The Lonestar (bad), An old Bowlback that was displayed as playable but really isn't (ugly- but I enjoy looking at it). I doubt you'll regret your washburn. It'll likely need a setup. If it's good enough tto get you to the next hump then I guess its worth it.

Jamie - Just being silly earlier because he loves his PacRim Eastman.

[musical mama]

Ok.... I'll try to add a pic here of the "wall-hanger" I bought off e-bay, supposedly made by a luthier in TN. It is not hanging, I play it. For a beginner, it's working.

[musical mama]

........and here's the back!

[otterly2k]

well, that back is awfully pretty!
It has a rather European look to it, although I suppose it's possible that it was made by a luthier in TN.

[musical mama]

I only regret that I know hardly anything about this mando; wood types, age, etc. I'll never sell it, as this is the only one I've ever seen with a back like this. Maybe they're out there, but I've not seen them. i hadn't thought about it having a european look, though. Guess I'll never know where it really came from....

[JEStanek]

That's a fine looking mando, Mama. Almost looks Moravian!
Jamie

[musical mama]

[QUOTE](JEStanek @ Feb. 28 2006 07:35)
Jamie -Proud of his Eastman Pac Rim Mando!

Anyone else want to tell what Pac-rim they own / play? The one I have coming is an F4 Washburn M4SW.

[Mark Walker]

I have a Lotus A-style that was made in Japan or Korea (I peeled the little sticker off years ago) that I've had for 10+ years. #Other than some details in the finish, it's a twin to many of the Kentucky A-styles I've seen. #
It plays and sounds decent for a cheapie (I think I paid $175 for it back then) and the only things I've done is had the neck heat-straightened and the set-up re-worked about a year ago (it's got no truss rod in it) and it's not a bad little piece of wood. #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[musical mama]

Wow! Now I know what to do with the one I posted a pic of earlier if the neck ever needs work, cause I'm sure it has no truss rod either. BTW, I took it for my first real lesson today (I've been learning on my own), and my instructor said it wasn't a bad little mandolin. I thought that was generous of her, considering she had a Gibson hanging on the wall! I really liked her, and I'm confident she can help me with the things I haven't figured out yet.

Oh, and if my new one (well, new to me) comes with a sticker, I'll peel it off, too!

[Mastersound]

Hi

I guess I'm a Pac-Rim maker too, although being in South Australia I'm actually on St Vincent's Gulf which is off the Southern Ocean, so maybe I should call myself an Antarctic Rim maker!

Looking at the eBay issue, I have to admit to being a fan of eBay. I've now built almost 80 instruments of various configurations, and without eBay as an outlet for my work I'd never have gone past the first handful. There's just not the market in my small state for things like solidbody electric mandos, ukes, tenor guitars, etc., but by being able to sell through eBay I've managed to have some fun making them and it seems at least some of the people who've bopught them are enjoying playing them. As always with eBay people need to read the details of the auction carefully, especially things like shipping costs. We've all seen auctions for guitars at one cent but with a shipping cost of a hundred dollars.

[guitharsis]

musical*mama,
Your mando is very pretty. Looks German to me. You might want to post over in Classical. Some of the folks there might be of help.