Tuned in 5 ths.

[d_j_hodson]

As builder I get asked to build "custom" 4 course instruments on a regular basis, often from my local UK market. (This is not a promo by the way)
The conversation often involves the customer saying it, needs to be tuned in 5ths, of a certain scale length, and the phrases, Zouki of Mando Cello often get abused. 9 times out of 10 it comes as a shock to most of them that what they are really looking for is in fact a TENOR GUITAR. Most think it is tuned as a guitar top 4!!!!
I just wondered how many other folk in this field do NOT realise that the Tenor guitar IS (should be) tuned in 5ths?
David
www.hodsonjazzguitars.com

[Michael Wolf]

Hi David,

I think many folks know this here, because of the arising interest in lower pitched instruments tuned in 5ths, mainly ocatve mandos/mandolas. I think tenors will (or should) become more popular, because their qualities still seems to be a bit underrated. On the other hand, to other, non-mando-people it seems nearly not possilble to explain that number of strings and the tuning is more crucial than the appearance of this instrument with it's shrunken guitar body. I often tell the story that the instrument was part of a job creation measure in the 30's to preserve jazz banjo players from joblessness.
I still want to play one of your nice django-tenors one day. I wonder how they sound for some irish tune playing.

Cheers
Michael

[John Flynn]

While it is indeed traditional to tune tenor guitars in fifths, DGBE (guitar top four) is also a legitimate tuning that is popular in the US, esepcially with jazz players and people wanting to cross over from the ukulele.

[Michael Wolf]

I didn't know that this is popular with jazz players in the US, is it? It is legitimate for sure. I only saw it from the mandolinists perspective and I thought that traditional jazz players would see it as a substitute for the tenor banjo what means playing in 5ths with guitar sound. But this all shows the versatility of the instrument.

[Bob DeVellis]

I remember something about the musicians' union being all upset about the more guitar-like tuning for tenors back in the day, because it allowed non-professional guitarists to jump in with tenor and accomplish much of what the guitar pros were doing (in jazz, primarily) with far greater ease. In other words, it was seen as a threat by the guitarists who had gone to the trouble of learning a new instrument when the banjo began to decline in popularity. Why the more guitar-like tuining posed a greater threat than a tenor tuned in fifths isn't immediately obvious -- maybe they didn't like them no matter how they werre tuned. But my recollection (which may be faulty) is that it was the DGBE tuning that was their main objection. Anyone heard this story?

[RolandTumble]

When I purchased a tenor guitar at a yard sale not too long ago, it was in DGBE (or close, being a bit out-of-tune even for that). I retuned it to relative fifths, off the G string, to try out. Part of the reason the seller took $5 off a "firm" price was that I knew what it was s'posed to be (even though she'd used it in DGBE its whole life-to-then). I also had to promise to give it a good home, which promise I believe I'm keeping.

[Fuzzyway]

Michael,

I've got a GOOD home for that tenor. That was a nice score you made...nice playing and great sound as I remember it.

Best, fuzzy

[Pete Martin]

I've played many tenors at mostly electric guitar oriented music stores that were tuned DGBE. #I think most people just don't know what a tenor is or is used for. #

As for tuning, why play a 4 string guitar tuned like a 6 string? #The 6 string has many more advantages. #BUT, tune it CGDA and all of a sudden a lot of things open up for the player.

Tenor is a very under appreciated instrument. #Get one and you'll see why.

Pete (1948 Martin O18T)

[RolandTumble]

Fuzzy--

That's one of the reasons that I'm sure I'll be able to keep the promise in the long run. If I ever decide I'm not doing it justice, I'll talk to you before resorting to eBay (or even craigslist, or the cafe classifieds, or...).

I'm still working with it--I've restrung it to GDAE (OM), and I'm working on translating my Irish repertoire to the fingering required by the longer scale. I've also gotten John McGann's OM guide, and I'm struggling with the rhythm playing (mostly successfully, but it's definitely uphill).

It doesn't "sing" quite as nicely as it did in CGDA, but nearly enough that I'll keep it there for now. I may try some adjustments to the string gauges next time I'm changing them.

[Michael Wolf]

Pete,

I'm not sure if the six string has that main advantages in the guitar tuning. I didn't try this to date on the tenor, but I think of uke or cavaqinho players. They play a 4th tuning and prefer four strings for their style and it works extremely nice. I think in some situations fewer is better, in deed. Maybe its the greater agility on a slim neck and a better overview (at least for me).

Cheers
Michael

[Tom C]

I believe Barry Mitterhoff tunes his tenor guitar like the top 4 strings of a guitar.

[glauber]

I'm not sure if the six string has that main advantages in the guitar tuning. I didn't try this to date on the tenor, but I think of uke or cavaqinho players. They play a 4th tuning and prefer four strings for their style and it works extremely nice. I think in some situations fewer is better, in deed. Maybe its the greater agility on a slim neck and a better overview (at least for me).
Cavaquinho is tuned like the top strings of the guitar, one octave higher. However, with the kind of strings we get in Brazil, the high e is very susceptible to breakage, so many/most people tune it to d, making DGBd instead of DGBe.

Uke is usually tuned aCEG (concert) or DGBe (tenor), with many other alternate tunings.

I believe the reason to tune like a guitar is that you are able to use the same guitar chord shapes you already know.

Higher tuned instruments don't always have 4 strings or courses. Charango, for example has 5. IMHO, the reasons why some instruments have 4 courses, 5, 6, etc, are historical, not necessarily ergonomic.

[billkilpatrick]

you said the magic word there mr. glauber. i've spent some time trying to convince the lute and vihuela crowd that the charango IS a vihuela or baroque guitar - but to no avail. i agree that its 5, paired courses indicates history ... and pedigree. for centuries, it was the common in south america to refer to all chordaphones as vihuelas. "god ..." - or european colonists in south america, at any rate "... creates, linnaeus disposes."

to be fair, the charango's most persistent point of reference is a recycled armadillo and a bunch of busking bolivians. if i saw a theorbo under those circumstances and it was all i knew of it, i'd probably have a hard time believing it came from elsewhere.