Portable Digital Recording

[craig]

does anyone have any experience with this? i've checked other threads, but none address this specifically.

rather than lug my laptop around, i'd like some advice on MP3 players/recorders that would work for amateur recording of live music, namely just my friends, family and self.

so far, i have found Sony Mini-disc recorder and Creative Labs Nomad Jukebox 3. anyone own one of those or have any experience with them?

any other recommendations?

thanks!

craig

[PapoAnaya]

Hello:

I just got a Toneworks Pandora PXR-4. It works pretty well. It can record in four tracks, has a built in tuner, metronome, 50 rhythm drum box, post recording effects, ad nauseum. Probably its biggest limitation is that it is only a 4 track tracker, but it is capable of merging those into virtual tracks. It downloads into a computer via USB and through card reader. Personally, I'm very happy with it.

Luis

[WV Mike]

Craig, I'm in the market for the same type of product. I'm recording now with an old Marantz cassette deck and a Sony stereo mic. I don't really need multiple track capability. I want good quality field recording that I can transfer to PC.

I've looked at the Nomad Jukebox and minidisk. I'm on hold right now until the new Hi-MD format is released this summer. You can store a lot more and it's supposed to allow digital near CD quality transfer back to PC for editing and burning to CD. Search minidisk and you will find a couple of forums on this stuff (too much stuff for me). I would like more info on the portable hardisks, but I kind of ran out of gas.

Good luck and keep us posted on your search.

Mike

[Ken Sager]

I love minidisk, mainly for the price of the media, but it can be a hassle to get tracks to a PC. I have to play the MD and into a cd deck, then rip the CD and edit away on the PC. It adds quite a bit of time to get them to PC, but I like the ease of use and cost of the MD. Very little of what I record on MD makes it to the PC. I mainly record shows and practice sessions, listen to them once or twice, then re-use the disk. I did a pretty good demo CD with a band using a 4 channel mixer with 4 condensers mixed stereo into the MD.

If there is a new format for MD I'll definitely be in line for that. I'll start researching now.

FWIW, a friend has used an mp3 recorder for the same purpose with great success.

There you go,
Ken

[WV Mike]

Guys, here's some links I had saved. #One from Sony on the new format and two discussion boards. #Have at it! #

Maybe we can compare notes and find the best solution. #I don't know where to search for pros and cons on portable harddrives versus MD and Hi-MD. Would appreciate help on that.


http://www.sony.net/Products/Hi-MD/index.html

http://www.minidisc.org/

http://www.minidisct.com/forum/index.php

Happy Research!

Mike - in Limbo with a Marantz Luggable Cassette Deck

[Bob DeVellis]

There's a cool new gizmo around that's made by Archos. It's sort of super-MP3 player that also handles video. You can record from TV, VHS, DVD, CD, radio, or other sources. It'll take a coaxial digital audio input or standard analog. Vidoe input is S-connector or composite. The screen's about 4" diagonally -- the size of a generous camcorder monitor. I believe that it converts audio to MP3 on the fly, but I'm not certain. VIdeo is saved as MPEG4. It also connects to the PC via USB or firewire, so getting files (of any type) to and from PC is a breeze. It has a built-in mic or can take external mics. The really cool thing is its capacity. Forget your puny memory stick. These come with hard drives of 20, 40, or 80 GB capacity! It'll hold thousands of tracks, not to mention dozens of movies on DVD and about a zillion photos in JPG or BMP. You can even get a camera attachment for it that lets you record either still images (1.3 megapixels) or video -- potentially for hours. They're pricey for the time being. But I must say, they really can do a lot and seem to do it remarkably well for a device about the size of four decks of cards 2 stacks of two, side-by-side (about 3 x 4 x 1 inches). I have no idea how these would work as an audio recording source, but they'd be way cool as a way to transport and play audio, video, and still image files. No financial interest, by the way. Sorry this sounds like an ad, I just think it's a cool product.

[mandolinquent]

I was looking for information on this last November when I wanted to record a nickel creek concert and decided to go with a Sony MD recorder. I was able to find one for only $50 so I bought it. I was excited to start using it and learning how it works when I first got it. After getting home and learning more, I realized that I could record all I wanted, but couldn't transfer anything I had recorded to the PC. Also, you can only check out and put songs on MD 3 times and no more. Apparently its the software that sucks (really sucks!), but I really dont know much about any of this. All I know is that for me its recording capabilities are useless and was kind of a waste if money. If it wasnt only $50, I woulda returned it. Big dissapointment!

[Blind_Cowboy]

Hey guys, please check these items out:

I have two studios for the last 4 years, one is primarily analog based, and one is a digital system. I would definitely recommend the following items for someone who's looking into getting into recording on a small scale. Check out the following links:

Zoom - PS04 Palmtop Personal Multi-Track Studio $199.99 at Sam Ash (http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/models/ps04/pdmodel.html)

Tascam - Pocketstudio 5 4-Track Compact Digital Multitrack Recorder $299.99 at Sam Ash (http://www.tascam.com/product_info.php?pid=274&nav=pocketstudio)

The above are two links for a Tascam and Zoom 4 track recorder. The Tascam has a name behind it and a couple of more features, but at a price tag $100.00 more. You can check them both out and make a decision.

Personally, I have liked the Zoom when I demo'd it. It has a SmartMedia card (32mb) that will record 32 mins. If you need more time, get a bigger card,(128 does 137mins) or multiple cards. The functions are easy to use, and it performed admirably. The Tascam has the same media card function.

It has a built in condensor mic, so you can throw it in the middle of the room. I don't like that it doesn't have a mic in. Instead, there is a line in and a guitar(Hi z) input jack. So, if you wanted to use a condensor mic you'd need a phantom power/DI box.

I'm touting the zoom, because from what I can tell, TASCAM's pocket studio has a higher pricetag for the same functions.

There are some bells and whistles that are nice (USB's to the computer. Zoom you have to take out the SM card and transfer the files that way) and well justify the added expense.

Both units are excellent. Choice is based on features, and I would definitely give these to a look.

Blind Cowboy...

[craig]

Luis,

now that's a pretty neat device. what format does it record in? MP3? WAV? is it battery operated? how much life do you get out of the battery?

[craig]

anyone heard of this? #check out the specs: #Archos Gmini 120 (http://www.archos.com/products/prw_500448_specs.html)

it has a line-in where you can hook up a mic or it has a built in mic. #with 20GB of storage, you could go nuts. #the only draw-back i see is no multi-track recording. #amazon has it for $213.14. #any comments on this?

[earthsave]

For the Zoom - PS04 Palmtop Personal Multi-Track Studio how much do Smart Card Readers cost?

[Rich]

The drawback to the MP3-hard drive recording devices is that they don't have a good "line-in" and require a pre-amp. I bought an Archos a year ago and worked and worked on the problem to no avail. The built in mic works fine, but records the sound of the machine clicking on and off when the memory fills and the machine turns on the hard drive--very loud and annoying even for those playing.

I gave up on the hard-drive MP3 recorder and bought a mini-disc recorder from sony that I love! We live recorded my bands CD with my mini-disc and had a wonderful recording to sell. The terrible drawback to the mini-disc, with no hope for a fix is that you have to run it analog into the computer to burn a CD.

[WV Mike]

Rich, see my earlier post and links. The soon to be released Hi-MD format by Sony is "Supposed" to allow digital back to PC, plus the new disks hold a lot more. Your can record in WAV or more compressed formats.

We'll see how this goes. I'm going to wait a while and check the feedback on the early units.

Mike

[craig]

mike,

i just checked out the sony hi-MD link you provided. it's not clear what the recording formats are? it looks like its "ATRAC3plus"! what the heck is that? is this the typical SONY move where they make their products only compatible with other SONY products?

[mrt10x]

Earthsave,, you can get card readers at Walmart or other places for as little as 20-30 bucks

[Rich]

That Sony HI-MD format sounds amazingly wonderful. I hope I can buy one soon! Thanks for the info. WV Mike.

[roland]

I got the Archos Gmini 120 late January. I used it to record a few jams at the Ajo Arizona fiddle contest, using the built-in mic. It did fine for that. I never noticed the drive starting and stopping or any noise created by that. I also purchased a special stereo mic for it (about 40 bucks) but didn't get around to trying it out yet. What's neat is the 20-gig capacity and the USB connection to computer to become another external drive. Moving recordings/files is just drag and drop. It's all MP3 for audio.
However, it just went belly-up under warranty, so I'm getting it fixed/replaced. Quickly, I hope. Even though it became unusable because the LCD display had disappeared, I could salvage my recordings because of the computer connection.

[craig]

roland,

sorry to hear about the misfortune with the Archos. i've been reading lots of reviews today at www.cnet.com and that seems to be the theme with most of the Archos products. it's too bad cause it's a nice concept and perfect size. hopefully they'll get the bugs worked out. hope they get you sorted out, too. a few of the reviews didn't speak highly about Archos tech support/customer service.

good luck!

craig

[StoneSt]

Craig, I just posted in another thread regarding the iriver ihp-120. #It's a hard drive based mp3 player/recorder. #Check it out, I've been very pleased with it. Here's the link to that thread. #BTW, I haven't had any probs with being able to hear the hard drive on recordings but then again I'm not doing studio quality stuff with it eather. #Anyway, here's the link to the other thread. #http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=8;t=13866 #Best of luck. #-Bob

[Jim Lyon]

FWIW I love using the minidisc. Yes you have to record it analog into your pc, but you just turn on the on board recorder, and go away for awhile. After its done you have a wav file you can play around with. I can record myself, record our band, record the jams and mainstage offerings at the music festival. As far as problems recording multiple times on a single disc, I have had no problems. I've used the same disc over and over, just like a memory card.

It's easy to use and extremely portable. There are some limitations, but they're not that hard to get around.

Jim

[Billy Mack]

I have been using the Sony MD also. It records in good quality and is easy to use. But, I agree that getting the recording to your PC is a pain. You cant use their software to transfer your own recordings back to the PC. I get around this by playing back in real time and recording it to .wav through my PC sound card. Then the .wav file can be edited, etc, and burned to a CD. I will be looking to see if their new product has this same limitation. Probably so.

[craig]

don't know how i missed this thread when i did my search, but jeff has a good thread going in Instruments and Equipment on this same topic: Portable Digital Recorders, Any recommendations? (http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=8;t=13866)

craig

[craig]

well, i've exhausted myself with researching this topic. here's what i came up with: MP3 Players/Recorders (http://www.mandolinproject.150m.com/mp3.html)

i put this chart together for myself, so i don't gurantee that all the info is 100% accurate. but, it is a place to start. so, far i'm keen on the "mobiBlu DAH520", "BenQ Joybee 150" or the monster "iRiver iHP 140". for the price, i don't think you can beat the first two. for the storage and size, you'd be hard pressed to find something with better specs than that iRiver! all the devices i've listed have a line-in where you could hook up a mic, but i don't know for sure whether you'd need a pre-amp or whatnot.

anyway, hope this helps you all. let me know if you see any of these things first hand.

craig

[PapoAnaya]

Luis,

now that's a pretty neat device. what format does it record in? MP3? WAV? is it battery operated? how much life do you get out of the battery?

1. MP2.
2. Yes, 2 AA.
3. I do not know http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif . I have not used it that much with batteries. I use it mostly at home. I guess something else to try when I get back home.

[craig]

luis,

what's mp2?

are you able to listen to the tunes on your computer and burn them to CDs?

[levin4now]

curious about this subject seeing as I will be at Steve Kaufman's Mando camp (oops I mean Kamp), this summer and need a way to record all these lessons!

Will be checking out the other threads b4 i start posting my own questions....

Curious about the cost for now of the Sony MD (w/usb out to PC). #(earlier in this thread someone said they had one for $50.)

...well, will go check ebay for starters....

[Christopher Howard-Williams]

That's worrying. I was recently given (for my 50th!) the Archos Gmini 220. The screen was so dark and difficult to read I sent it back to have it brightened. I have not yet got the product back so cannot report on the ###.
Other than that, it is a really cool and sexy nd does all it say - very easy drag and drop system connected to USB.
I have heard about the video product too, but don't know how it works.

[yoods]

"I'm on hold right now until the new (Sony) Hi-MD format is released this summer."
-WV Mike

Does anyone have an update on this? I am interested in transfering to the computer aspect as well.

Has it come out or do you know when it will come out? Is there a link on the web to read more about this? Thanks!

[WV Mike]

Dave, the Hi-MD format release was delayed again and is now slated for June. I'm still torn between going to Hi-MD or the portable hard disks. The Sony 900 Model is the one I'm looking at. It will cost around $240M.

here's some links..

http://www.minidisct.com/forum/index.php

http://www.minidisc.org/

Good luck, Mike