HOW DO YOU ALL DO IT?!

[tombnorton]

ok, i browse the builders boards about every day, and i constantly see #1 mandolin. you all build such beautiful mandolins, even on your first try! how the HECK does this happen? do you have previous woodworking experience? or do you magically produce a fine instrument? i really want to try my hand at building, but i dont have any of hte resources necessary, such as tools, wood, etc. id love to know the "behind hte scenes" of these great #1's

[J. Wiens]

I'm a builder and I don't get it either. I'd never show my #1 on here....It's hideous!

I think it's to the credit of Scott's website and the enormous amount of information shared here that people are now making top notch instruments on their first or second go.

Ten years ago there wasn't a fraction of the information available that there is now and The Mandolincafe and Comando messageboards are defintiely to blame .......Jamie http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[evanreilly]

Amazing what one can do with mere ones and zeros.....

[dstretch]

Tomb

It is not that we just we magically produce a fine instrument. The fact is that if you are patient, and really take care in what you are doing you can make a fine instrument. If you buy a kit, stew-mac, siminoff, or the IV kit you can build a very nice instrument. Even with out a lot of tools. Just patience, and effort. This board has so much information and help available so use it.
But you will never build a fine instrument if you don't start!!!

Here is me and my #1 built with no more than a dremel tool, RO sander, 1 finger plane, and lots of sand paper. Just go at it.

[Bill Snyder]

I suspect that many of these instruments look just about as good up close as they do in pictures, but I can show you a few flaws, blemishes, etc., on the few instruments I have built that don't show up in my postings here. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[El Rey del Mando]

I have posted pictures of my #1 and #2,This way you will see that everyone does not produce a beauty the first and second time out.I sure had fun though and they sound good.Someone on here convinced me that I should try a third,I won't say any more than the first letter of his first name is...... Dale..... (oops!)so,I'm on my way with #3.You should try one too.

John

[Ellie]

"It is not that we just we magically produce a fine instrument."

Maybe you guys don't, but I do. After swimming the Bermuda Triangle without getting wet, learning how to juggle grease coated chainsaws locked on full throttle, and how to think backwards while holding the seven bladed windbreaker and singing the entire Bobby Goldsboro musical catalog in seven different octaves at the same time, learning the right mojo casting spell to make instruments magically appear was easy.

[dstretch]

Wow Ellie could you make 1923 Loar appear in my mandolin case today??? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[Fretbear]

Danny left out the best part...he got a fantastic F-5 mandolin to play while still eating and having somewhere to live....

[8ch(pl)]

Ellie, in what languages do you sing Bobby Goldsboro? Do you ever harmonize in one language while singing the melody in another, that would be so neat!

[Ellie]

I can only sing the seven octaves at once, but instead of trying to do harmony parts, I often sing it backwards to simulate a different language, and it helps offset the savage meathook reality of having the lyrics to "Watching Bobby Grow" or "Honey I miss you" stuck in the spin cycle of the mind.
I think I slept in the day they were teaching how to make old Gibsons appear. I may have been heavily sedated, or I might have been out learning how to make soup out of styrofoam packing pellets.
I have been able to make import plywood screamer mandolins combust. I use naptha for that magic trick.

[Chris Burt]

Photographs, especially the low-res compressed images shown on this forum, are often kind to their content. In thirty-four years of luthiery experience, I've never seen a first instrument, or even a second or third, that didn't look like an education in progress. I've seen early instruments that displayed evidence of significant native talent, but even these were still, obviously, instruments from early in a talented luthier's career. Building fine musical instruments requires patience, dedication, the mastery of many skills and technologies, not a little talent, and (as I'm constantly forced to remember) a flexible and wide-open mind.

It's never too late to begin. My seventy-nine year old father, who is beginning to learn ukulele building, is example of this. If you've the temperament, learning luthiery is a source of great exhilaration and personal reward. Oh yeah, frustration can raise its ugly head now and then.

[tope]

I can't agree with Jamie and Chris enough. When I started building guitars 30 years ago there was 1 book available (Sloane) and that wasn't very good, no internet. There is an incredible amount of info available today here on this and other sites. Use it, a first time builder can with patience and common sence build a good sounding instrument the first time out. There will be flaws that won't show in the photos that will be cured after the first few instruments. Go for it.

[hungry mountain boy]

So how much money does the kit, the dremel, RO sander(whatever that is) and the other stuff the guy mentioned before cost?

[Bill Snyder]

Which kit?
Stewart Macdonald has the Campfire Mandolin, F5 and A5, Siminoff has F4, F5, and A5 and various options available. International Violin's kit is an A-style ($95 without the "old" Siminoff book). Luthiers Mercantile (LMI) has a kit that essentially the materials. Then there are the laminated wood kits from Grizzly, MusicMakers. Then I think there are kits available from FolkCraft and Lark in the Morning.
For solid wood F-style kits though the choices are Stewart Macdonald, Siminoff and LMI.
The different kits involve different amounts of work and tooling needed.
I think the StewMac catalog lists the tools that they recommend.
BTW the RO sander is a random orbital sander. Cheap ones are $30 and a decent Porter Cable is $60.

[Gibson A5]

I don't know how they look so good for a first either. Here is a photo of my #1 in progress and I hope it turns out as good as theirs or close. It has a cedar top and walnut sides, back and neck (with oak strip)only because I own a lot of walnut. I don't have a band saw, so all my non stright cuts have been with a $170 Dremel Scroll saw. The peghead just did fit because of the angle head cut. I am lucky enough to have a thickness planer and table saw. The band saw will come later. I haven't cut a truss rod slot. Can any of you experinced builders tell me if I need the truss rod or will the oak strip be enough? Thanks,
Bill

[sunburst]

Can any of you experinced builders tell me if I need the truss rod or will the oak strip be enough?
In all honesty, no, nobody can tell you if you'll ever need a truss rod in the neck.

Walnut is pretty stiff and stable, oak is even stiffer, if you have the grain vertical throught the neck, (90 degrees to the fingerboard) and the wood was chosen carefully for striaghtness and evenness of grain, you probably won't need one.

I look at the situation this way:
I probably won't need a truss rod, but if it's there and I don't need it, I like that better than if it's not there and I do need it.

[rattler]

I built my #1 about 15 years ago. No pictures exist but we did give it a nice Viking Sendoff. (you know, threw it into a boat shoved out from shore and shot flaming arrows into it)

The comedic value was worth far more than the mandolin was. Incidentally, there was never a #2. I was so demoralized by that one exploding in my hands that I bought my first F2 and never looked back.

I may try again now that I'm older and have no sense of shame.

[stevem]

Agree with the picture comments. I got excited about this one relatively new builder when looking at pictures online so I drove a couple hours to check them out in person. Not bad overall, but definitely needed some serious work on the details. I think it's rare if a new builder posts a pic that shows their flubs. It's no fun that way.
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Dale Ludewig]

GibsonA5- first off, my first F5, although I was proud of it at the time, will not be shown for public view! It takes time and mistakes, I think, to get it. And an F5 as a first project is going to be challenging.

That said, the one thing I can say viewing the photos you took, if they're accurate, watch out in the scroll area, where the rise on the inside of the scroll comes up to meet the "button". You may have done what I did on my first F scroll- I carved it as though it was going to be the final profile. I forgot that I had to leave a ledge where the bindings meet right there at the button. If you don't, the binding is going to have to go up a radical rise that basically "isn't there anymore". Try to visualize it. In order for the binding to meet there properly, you've got to leave room for the ledge the binding is going to sit on. They should meet level on the top, not with the inside binding coming up so steep that it looks odd, or doesn't make it at all with the same height of binding.

Look at it carefully and see if your binding is going to be able to do that after the ledge is cut. If it isn't, it's not going to look right. If it isn't, it might be worth making new plates or making your "button" shorter (less tall). I hope I'm making some sense. I can't tell for sure if you're going to have the same problem I did when I did my first one. But before you glue the plates on, it would be good to think about it.

Looks like you're doing great. But that scroll- it's the problem area for all mando builders. Carry on!

[newmando7]

Well I am building my #1 and hope and pray that every step I do not make a mistake.I am almost finished with my first neck/headstock it has been a process,and also a great learning experience.I am taking my time and did a few practice necks to help me along the way.I am very happy with the result so far but I am very picky and have a great attention to detail.I never thought that it would take so much time & effort for each step but I know now that I will have something wonderful when I finish my project.Everyday I think about what my next step will be and what I will have to invision along the way but when I have that work of art in my hand and when it is all said and done I will be so proud of myself for making the efort.There is no way I will sell my #1

[RJinRI]

To Tombnorton...well, I'm also attempting #1 (started in March'05) and have also purchased the IV kit. I'm certain the kit will turn out just wonderful, tho I do have doubts about the scratch built #1. the key with anu project is to keep plowing forward, take your time, and if you do make a boo-boo, hopefully it can be corrected without scrapping the whole project. My woodworking skills are limited, using a finger plane is tuff on the fingers, making true cuts with bandsaw is still a chore and i have no idea what will happen when i reach the finishing stages...will cross those bridges when the time comes. So, Mr. Tombnorton...keep reading the posts here & wherever else you can find info, but by all means just go out & buy some wood, or the IV kit & DO IT !

[Gibson A5]

Dale and Sunburst, thanks for the replies. I'm sure I'll make a lot of mistakes and I'll more than likely be carving some new plates. This first try is exciting and I thank you all for your input as I go. I'll be doing more posts as I continue. My 64 Gibson two point scroll head A5 is the only "live" mando I have to look at for any length of time so the only help it was was being able to look at the head. Sometimes it hard to tell just where carved sections meet and run from the plans. Dale, I'll sure check the scroll area like you said, thanks for the tip.
Bill
P.S. does walnut burn good?

[sunburst]

P.S. does walnut burn good?
Excellent grill or bar-b-que wood!

You will make mistakes.

My #1 was ordered, actually, and is still being played by the guy that ordered it. You see, I was already an instrumnet builder, but hadn't made any mandolins.
That was about 20 years ago, and I keep being reminded that there are mistakes lurking out there that I don't even know about. The mistakes that you've made, been told about, or best of all, saw somebody else make, are pretty easy to avoid. The challenge is avoiding the mistakes that you don't even know exist. I visualize them lurking around corners waiting for the chance to leap into my mandolins when I look the other way...

[Spruce]

"Amazing what one can do with mere ones and zeros....."

In a 100 years, folks will look back on this statement and nod in agreement...

The internet has encouraged quantum leaps in many artforms, and building mandolins is certainly one of them...
It's stunning the amount of information that is out there these days, and building F5's is all about information...
You can read more today on how to carve an F-hole than you could read about the whole dang building process in '71 or so....

When I first started to build my first F5, there was no information out there as to how to do it...
No Siminoff, no GAL, no ASIA, and certainly no body of information contained in one spot like this here Cafe to guide me as to how to build one of the most difficult instruments on planet Earth to build--the F5 mandolin....

Siminoff's book came out as I was carving the top, and that was an exciting day...

"you all build such beautiful mandolins, even on your first try! how the HECK does this happen? "

Some folks have it, and some don't, regardless of their previous woodworking skills....

I've seen a lot of #1's (hey Bruce, here's your wood!!), and it's astounding how they vary...

In my case, I quit building mandolins because I started hanging out with folks who had it, and I never really did...
In fact, I, ummmm, sucked... #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif