Developing Volume

[Daniel Nestlerode]

I've been paying attention to the phenomenon of "personal mandolin voice." I've played my Capek, a Gil, a Newson, a couple of Gibsons, and a few others I cannot remember and I always sound like me give or take a little here or there. I've also noticed that my duo partner sounds like himself when he plays my Capek rather than his Gil, which is in its way quite comforting because it means I really don't need a Gilchrist. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

So here's the rub, apparently I play more quietly than most people I've played with. I'd like to develop better volume, but I'm at a loss has to how to go about it, and I'd like to avoid hardware "fixes" like a tonegard unitl I'm better at generating more volume. This way I woun't be using a tonegard as crutch.

So... Any one have any recommendations for techniques to develop volume?

Thanks!
Daniel

[J. Mark Lane]

Hit the strings harder?



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[Don Christy]

I don't have all that much skill or volume, so take this for waht it's worth. I've noticed that when I relax and play with a looser right hand I get more volume. My problem is that when I do that I'm sloppier as I really need to work on my technique in general. If I'm right about the relaxed approach helping with volume, maybe work on a song that you have well memorized and is easy for you to play and just relax and really attack those strings.
Good luck
Don

[Mando4Life]

a thinner pick may help...also realize that you may sound louder than you think in a group setting...but in reality I think you just need to "dig-in" more...like J. Mark said...i've been working on that myself lately..

WBL

[PaulD]

I assume you're aware of the fact that how you hear your mando (standing behind it) is not the same as what others hear standing in front. Other than that, and what's been suggested, I would make sure you're not resting your hand or forearm on the bridge or the instrument top and damping it. It's pretty easy to do... at least for me it is.

I also play with a relatively stiff, pointy pick when I want to be loud and a Golden Gate (round) pick when I'm after a softer tone. Having to rely on two different picks may be considered a crutch, though. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Paul Doubek

[Jeff A]

Hold the mando away from your body. Players do this for more volume as the body will muffle the sound.

The tonegard does the exact same thing but in a more comfortable playing position. Dawg, Mike Marshall, and Skaggs all use tonegards.

[Tennessee Jed]

I agree with Paul about the mando sounding louder when you are in front of it. When I'm playing in the living room with the TV on sometimes I can hardly hear the mando over the TV but my wife tells me I'm playing too loud and she can't hear the TV. We usually don't hear what we are playing the way others do.

[jasona]

You know what I'm discovering? That if you dig the pick in *less* you get more *pop* from the strings. I've gone back to a 1.14" Ultex teardrop and I play that with significantly less pick showing through my fingers. The result is that I am brushing the tops of the strings rather than dragging the pick through them. This also results in faster playing since the pick doesn't have to "recover" to the neutral playing position.

[meskalito]

I play loud as ****. #I also rest my forearm on the bridge and sometimes post with my fingers. #I still always sound loud.

Why? #Because I have a strong ****ing wrist. #Practice playing downstrokes consecutively i.e. the Bill Monroe blues style. #Play as loud as you can until you get buzzing and then back it off a tiny bit.

I also think you need a stiff grip on the pick.

Have you heard of the rest stroke? (http://flatpick.com/Pages/FAQ/question.php?question=Rest_Stroke)

Jeremy http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[Dale Ludewig]

My suggestion: thick pick. Loose right hand. Maybe an arm rest so you have little weight on the bridge. Fairly pointy pick. And practice. practice. practice....

Daniel- I've been meaning to say this for some time- I wonder how many people get the Firesign Theater reference? Shoes for the dead!

[Daniel Nestlerode]

OK, score so far:
Thin pick.
Thick pick.
Tense arm.
Relaxed arm.
Pointy pick.

hmmm.... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

yes, I think I should get s third party to listen to me and my friend play my mandolin one after the other and divulge who the louder of the two of us is. Then I'll pick his brain for his technique and see if adopting some of his style will help (that is if I am quieter).

thanks all, and keep it coming!

[Dale, check your PM box]

Daniel

[jasona]

Don't forget: "Dig in less" "Dig in more"

[David Horovitz]

What Dale said!

All of what he listed are things I've been trying and working for the past couple of years and I think it's helped my volume and tone. Of course, I still struggle with both. Ah grasshopper, wax on, wax off. . .

What's with the second Firesign Theatre reference: "[I think] we're all bozos on this bus"? Are you trying to tell us something?

[Jakester]

Find a stairwell with concrete and tile walls. You will be surprised at how loud you will sound.
Also clean your ears and be sure to breath. Just half a joke there. I can tense up during difficult passages and the result is pressure on the inner ear which creates a white noise that will compete with the sound of the instrument.

Nothing like those downstrokes.

Jim Jenigen
Richmond, VA

[J. Mark Lane]

"What's in the bag?"

[jasona]

I'd like to develop better volume, but I'm at a loss has to how to go about it, and I'd like to avoid hardware "fixes" like a tonegard unitl I'm better at generating more volume.
I have been listening to my mando with and without my ToneGuard a lot recently. I swear my tone is much richer without it on. The sides of my mandolin are very active when I strum--vibrating much more than the back, so I'm starting to think that the ToneGuard mutes these tones when its on. Anybody else notice something similar?

[mandroid]

Tone gards are #a varnish saver, as well as a resonant spacer for the back. I should have gotten a year or more #ago, put mine on my 21 A4 before I made too much if a wet t-shirt #impression on it .
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[steve in tampa]

Try playing up close to a door or wall so the sound reflects back.

"I never lie, I'm always right, and you can believe me because I know" George L. Tirebiter

[AlanN]

Good technique is a combination of subtle and not-so-subtle events. The latter has been suggested above - thick pick, more forceful pick strokes, etc.

One piece of advice I can give is let your left and right hands 'hang'. Almost Zen-sounding, this to me is crucial to pull tone. Milk each note for what it's worth. Perhaps more applicable on slow tunes, this technique will carry on to faster numbers where you want to let notes ring as long as you can.

[John Flynn]

"I never lie, I'm always right, and you can believe me because I know" George L. Tirebiter
Brought to you by the Department of Redundancy Department, Sector B

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[Steve L]

When I find I need more volume, I tend to play louder http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

"How can you be in two places at once when you're not anywhere at all?"

[Daniel Nestlerode]

Hard to tell, but last night may have been an improvement. I used a horn pick that I modified by rounding a corner a little and adding a beveled edge. I usually use a Wegen M-150, and as a result have been thinking about going to the Wegen Bluegrass pick or a Wegen M-100.

Truth be told, I'm also thinking about getting a Collings MT and seeing if it is any louder than my Capek Old Era. (I'm having a prolonged bout of AMAS and the house needs a new roof more than I need a new mandolin, so the outright purchase of a new musical instrument would at the very least be an unecessary detriment to my marriage.) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

"Heck no, Mudhead. I'm going to cut the soles off my shoes, climb a tree, and learn how to play the [mandolin]!" --Porgy Tirebiter

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Daniel

[twaaang]

"If you don't answer the question, we'll have to gag you."

[Pete Martin]

Volume can be increased somewhat, but more important to my ears is smooth tone production. #A smooth tone carries farther, allowing a player to be heard more clearly.

A factor in this can be how much speed the pick has when it goes through the strings. #The faster through the strings (assuming a pick that is thick enough and held loosely), the better the tone. #This also assumes you have a decent instrument. #Cheap instruments often give out at certain levels and above.

Work on your tone quality and others will be able to hear you. #When performing, you will come across a mic better as well.

[jmcgann]

Andy Statman suggested to me (about 25 years ago) to let gravity do the work. if you can relax your wrist, and allow the fingers that aren't holding the pick to curl up naturally without pulling them in, it works fantastically. More here.Technique Tips (http://www.johnmcgann.com/techtips.html)