String Manufacturing

[futrconslr]

I had a person tell me one time that there are only about 3 different guitar string factories and that they are all made by these folks and packaged for different brands. Is that the way it is for mando strings?

[acousticphd]

I had a person tell me one time that there are only about 3 different guitar string factories and that they are all made by these folks and packaged for different brands.

I'll buy that, based on what I've heard and been told. #

When the StringThis.com site (the former bulk string sellers) started, and for their first couple of years, this was in fact their exact marketing campaign/claim, ie: "All strings are the same! #It's a well-known secret that there are only a couple mfrs! #Strings cost way too much! #Until now!" #Now StringThis.com sells name brands, mainly Martin and D'Addario, for quite a bit more than when they had only the generic, unnamed strings. #I can't believe they have actually changed sources. #I also used to buy bulk instrument strings from a shop that carried either Martin, or D'Addario bulk gauges. #So I don't know #who the actual mfrs are, but this makes me think Martin and D'Addario are the two major mfrs or string outsourcers.

The bulk strings I've bought and used over the last 4-5 years sometimes have had a brand on them (like Martin or D'Addario), usually not. #Sometimes I have bought ball-end strings for mandolins or mandola and broken out the brass ball; or more usually I get loop-end for the mando instruments. #I just bought about 4 dozen assorted sets and extras (which I hope will see me through 2005!)

Except for the loop-end vs ball end and string lengths, all the generic bronze or phos. bronze round-wound strings - whoever was actually making them - have sounded, felt, and lasted very similarly to me. # When I've bought packaged strings, they have most often been D'Addario and GHS (for mandolin) or Martin (for guitar). #I don't personally find any noticeable differences between name and generic wound strings. #The plain steel strings, electric or acoustic or instrument-type, seem even more generic; I can detect no differences between any of those I've ever used, except that strings in new packaged sets can sometimes look brighter and "fresher". # There are plenty of preferences, and may in fact be some real differences, but to me, having newer strings makes the most difference.

[Milan Christi]

I'm not buying that one - no one is making TIs for Thomastik. And I just read an article (somewhere) about Martin's string manufacturing.

[John Flynn]

I have heard that also, but that should not be taken to mean that a generic brand is necessarily the same as a name brand. I have a little familiarity with wire manufacturing. The wire factory would take an order from a brand-name musical string company and generally that order would be filled to that string company's specs, including core diameter, winding diameter, metal composition, quality standards, etc. If then the factory did an order for another string company, those strings might be turned out on the same machines by the same people, but to entirely different specs, so they would be different strings.

[futrconslr]

I was kinda curious. I had a new bridge put on and the guy put some new strings on due to breaking a couple of my old ones. The new set just never felt/sounded "right" and my instructor was really giving me #### about playing with no volume. I put my old faithfulls on and it sounded "right" When he gets back in town we will see if volume improved. Both sets were phospher bronze and the set that the repair guy put on was from a company I used to use that sounded good on my other mandolin. Maybe its all in my head!!!

[futrconslr]

why is C.R.A.P. a bad word?

[Fretbear]

I bought a bunch of generic bulk singles from just strings.com for my bouzouki, and while they do the job, I now prefer to buy brand-name bulk packages (of 5 or 6) from FQMS. They are of the highest quality, loop or ball-end, and they are very reasonably priced. They have everything that you can imagine, and you can afford to be picky and switch out thin A strings from pre-packaged sets, etc....

[grant_eversoll]

This has been my thoughts as well...a string is a string is a string. 80/20 is 80/20 if it comes from Martin or Big Joe's bargain strings. I used to do some business with a music store that sold their own brand strings, they had the owners photo on the set and he sold them cheaper than other strings but he told me they were the same strings and that anyone who wanted to order enough strings could do the same thing

Can we really tell the difference in strings or is it all in our head? Can we really remember exactly what string set X sounded like when we put them on last month as compared to string set Y that we just put on.

I have been playing guitar for 28 years and the only thing I can honestly say that I can tell the difference in is gauge... Just my $.02 worth

[Philip Halcomb]

I've done a lot of experimenting with this, I believe there is a difference. For instance, I like to compare the Gibson Monroe strings to the D'Addario J74 set. Very close in guages. This test is put em' on take em' off, etc... I used to use J74s religiously, they sound great when first put on. However after a day of hard playing, they were trash. I put the Monroe's on and they sounded like my dead J74s. So I put a new set of J74s and we were sounding good again. I don't tend to to have afixations with brands so I don't think it was in my head. Now I use the JS74s they last longer than the both of them. I ordered bulk from JustStrings, same guages and metals as the J74s. They sounded dead all the time. Age, quality, different manufacturer. Several variables could be at play on this one.

[Milan Christi]

Can we really remember exactly what string set X sounded like when we put them on last month as compared to string set Y that we just put on.
Yes, I can. I went through about 20 sets of strings until I found the ones that had the balance I was looking for on my guitar. Took me months and a lot of money to decide.

Now I'm going through the same process for both of my mandolins. I can tell you that TIs are a w-o-r-l-d apart from the tonal characteristics of J74s. The TIs sound great on my Weber (maybe a bit too dark) but they sound terrible on my old Gibson A. The Sam Bush set sounded pretty nice on the Weber but didn't last very long.

I just ordered more string sets to continue the search. I know what sound I'm looking for - chances are I'll probably find it. Honestly I'd LOVE to find the tone I want on a set of $3, no-name strings. I don't write anything off just because of price. (I'm thrilled that the TIs don't meet my criteria for tone!! And so is my sponsor/wife!!)

[glauber]

Keep us posted, Mc! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
I'd love to find out what the best strings are, without having to spend all that money.

[Milan Christi]

Keep us posted, Mc! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
I'd love to find out what the best strings are, without having to spend all that money.
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif Hahahaha! What works for me may not work for you. But I promise I'll tell you. I was really enamored with the TIs when I first tried them but after a couple sets I don't care for the bottom end. (or the bottom line) The ones on order right now are the D'Addario Flattops - hey, they work for Thile!

[acousticphd]

I can tell you that TIs are a w-o-r-l-d apart from the tonal characteristics of J74s.

The ones on order right now are the D'Addario Flattops

I agree that flatwound strings and semi-flatwounds, like the D'Addario flattops, are not in the same category (and cost quite a bit more) as the more common roundwound varieties/brands. It's the latter category I referred to in my earlier comments, and these vs. bulk strings all seem too similar to develop a preference. That doesn't mean I hold that there is no difference between makes, just not enough to matter to me. I like to keep fresh strings on a number of instruments I use most, and usually only play several sessions/jams per set, and I'm happy with the sound of fresh generic strings, which may be D'Addarios anyway, for all I know.

The original

[mandroid]

the music wire and winding wire manufacturers may be few, the winding work station tools are not large, so many companys own several.

[Charlie Derrington]

I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong) there are 6 or 7 domestic producers and several more offshore.

Charlie

[Darryl Wolfe]

I think this is just like golf balls http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

I like this brand better than that one, when they identical exept the branding

[mort]

I've taken a micrometer to the strings to see if they were .40 ie G or what ever the measurement said on the package (It was smaller). It wasn't the same as the package said. I've done this casually several times. Anyone else notice this or try this before?

[Charlie Derrington]

Take it one step further, Mort...

Take measurements at different spots on the string. You'll find some brands aren't even consistent along the same string. This causes intonation problems (for correct intonation, the mass on the left side of fret twelve has to be the same as the mass on the right side).

Windings also (if tighter towards one end or the other) need to be the same or, again, intonation problems.

I believe the common accepted manufacturing standard is .001 tolerence of the stated diameter.

Charlie

[Steven Stone]

I did an article on strings for Acoustic Guitar Magazine a couple of years back, and no, there are not just a few makers rebranding their output.

Lets see, off the top of my head here are the distinct makers I looked at, and no, none of them were identical, even with the same specs - Martin, D'Addario. Gibson, Martin, GHS, Black Diamond, Dean Markey, and DR. I'm sure there are more, but I'm old and I can only remember so much as one time.

Each had different tricks including hand winding (possible sham) core shapes, tensile strengths, tempering, alloy configurations, and preservation techniques.

Yeah, there's just a couple of strings makers, just like there are only a couple of good mandolin builders http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[John Flynn]

I am privledged to take lessons from Curtis Buckhannon, who I sought out for instruction because I love his playing. He is my favorite old-time player and has a great sound that is all his own. He is always bemoaning that he has waited too long to change strings, but he procrastinates because he hates changing them. When he gets around to changing strings, he says he buys "whatever is on sale." He seems to have no allegiance to any brand of strings. Yet for a year and half, hearing him play close up, he always gets the same incredible tone. New strings, old strings, this brand, that brand, he always sounds great. So while the present sting discussion is very interesting, I wonder if sometimes we place more emphasis on string choices than it deserves.

[fatt-dad]

So, where is the nearest string making factory to Richmond, Virginia? I want to go there and see how they do it. Then I want to find out what R&D is going on in making strings. For example, has anybody tried to make strings from Kevlar? If GHS (amoung others) use a silk core with pb or steel winding, what about Kevlar wound by pb or steel? Would anybody care?

f-d

[John Flynn]

Well, Elixers are coated in Gore-tex, so suppose Kevlar is not too far fetched. Or what about the fire retardant fabric, Nomex, that is used in jump suits for fighter pilots and race car drivers? That way, nothing would combust if you are playing too hot!

[Desert Rose]

Charlie said

I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong) there are 6 or 7 domestic producers and several more offshore.

Charlie is exactly right.

Music wire manufacturers in the US , there is one that I can think of Mapes and they supply everybody

A large majority of all strings are made by three makers that do OEM work, not counting people like Gibson Fender Martin that make their own

The biggest are GHS DiAddario and Vinci

Scott

[Desert Rose]

Charlie said

I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong) there are 6 or 7 domestic producers and several more offshore.

Charlie is exactly right.

Music wire manufacturers in the US , there is one that I can think of Mapes and they supply everybody

A large majority of all strings are made by three makers that do OEM work, not counting people like Gibson Fender Martin that make their own

The biggest are GHS DiAddario and Vinci

Scott

[Michael Gowell]

I've noticed that the newest thing in guitar strings are nickel or bronze wrapped titanium cores. #Low corrosion, long life, & lower tension (thus easier fretting) are the alleged benefits, with the expected trade-off of higher price ($20/set). #For those interested, google 'Rohrbacher Titanium Strings'.

Do folks think that the relatively modest mando marketplace will someday motivate a manufacturer to offer this kind of technology to us?

[fatt-dad]

Why wouldn't they just use titanium for the wrapping too for the complete "high tech" affect?

f-d

[Desert Rose]

Why wouldn't they just use titanium for the wrapping too for the complete "high tech" affect?

f-d

Because you would be changing frets every month. With frets and strings you have to find a balance

Scott