Pointy vs Rounded

[RHBoy]

Hi
I have been lurking here a long time and have noticed many folks like the rounded style picks, such as the golden gate, dawg, jazztone 207, ect. I have been using a jazztone 206 pointed teardrop for some time and like it. My question is: Is there a reason the rounded is preferred vs the pointed? I have experimented with picks and found it is hard for me to get the desired tone/volume from a rounded pick-however. Is it harder to drive a pick like the golden gate vs a pointed style? Should I just hit it REALLY hard to get the sound:)?
Thanks everyone!

[Dfyngravity]

the rounded picks like the "dawg" do create less volume if you are using the same attack as a more "pointed" pick. i used one before and didn't care for the volume although i did get a pretty good tone. i think it seems to be a "faster" pick....if that's how you would describe it. i use a dunlop gator pick and for me i get the perfect tone i am looking for, great tremelo, good speed, and good volume. although the 5 picks i use had been well worked for the last 2 years...i switch back and forth to get even wear. but as for the rounded pick, i am right there with you...not as much volume and not the tone i am looking for, although this is all personal preference. some people have a very hard attach with their pick stroke and can get more volume out of the rounded picks.

[mandopete]

Seems like I go through this dilemma every 6 months or so. I started off with a compromise - a d'Andrea tri-corner pick which to me, was a bit more rounded that the classic teardrop shape. I then switched to a genuine tortoise shell pick in the same shape, but found I did not like it. I then went to a thinner, pointier shape (think Clayton) in tortoise shell and found that worked well for about a year.

Now I find that I'm going back to less of a point. I've been concentrating on the the angle of the pick. For me, I find that if my angle is fairly parrallel to the string, the rounded shape produces a better tone. Problem is that I have gotten a bit lazy in the right hand and the pointier shape was masking the problem for me.

Good luck in this. I find that it helps to go stand in front of a mirror (and admire yourself) to see exactly what you're doing with respect to angle of attack. It also helps to hear what your doing as well.

[250sc]

RHBoy,

While cleaning out a drawer I found a couple of Dawg picks that I purchased a couple of years ago and decided they weren't for me. I decided to give them another try and found they still weren't what worked for me. Since I really like the Wegen picks I took a emery board and shaped one of the points like a Wegen and I liked using the Dawg better than when it was stock but the real round tip still wasn't to my liking. Every one and every mando is different so I'm just stating my personal opinion but you might try to reshape the bevels a bit to see if you find something you like.

Good luck.

[Philip Halcomb]

I think the thing with the dawg pick is just getting used to them. I use em' and can be as loud as my mando will allow. I dare say I can be louder than with the pointy picks. But like I said, it's a matter of what you're used to. For me the thin pointy picks just create too much pick noise that I don't care for.

[Ken Sager]

I've found the rounded picks to be less bright, but if I keep the rounded pick parallel to the strings I can get a lot more volume from them without having to drive them harder. Pointed picks seem to be more forgiving on pick direction in their ability to provide volume, but are sometimes too bright. I prefer the 207, but will often play with a 208 (same thing with a point) to get certain tonal responses the 207 won't provide.

They're all different, and you're already doing the best thing you can -- experiment to discover what works best for you, your mandolin, and your desired output.

Best,
Ken

[mandroid]

Having found Fender #347 is the same shape as the old fave, Gibson star (*) a large teardrop,It is both, depending on rotation. I just have to justify a half gross purchase of the extra heavy thick ones, to get any, via LMS.

[glauber]

Right now i'm still using the Ultex 1.14 triangle. I have one that i filed the other 2 points so i have 3 different degrees of pointiness in one pick. I use the original point most of the time, though. The Dunlop 208 and 207 are about as good as the Ultex, but i prefer the Ultex's larger triangle shape.

[Spencer]

There's a mathematical procedure for calculating and breaking down the structure of waves (Fourier analysis). It basically says you can construct any wave form by adding up a (potentially endless) number of waves of increasing frequencies (harmonics), where the each harmonic is multiplied by a number you need to calculate, which determines how loud that harmonic is.

The sharper the wave form, the more of the higher frequency harmonics you need include to get the shape right. Turned around, that means that when you have a sharp point in your wave form, that is the shape of the string you pick, you have excited more of the higher frequencies. These form the basis of the sound you get when you play.

Translating that to rounded/pointed picks, the sharper the point, the more pointed the wave you start with, and the more higher frequencies you get, one of the biggest differences between the pointed and rounded picks. You can see what I mean by a stretching a rubber band between your thumb and middle finger, then stretching it sideways first with something sharp like a pencil point, and then something round like your other thumb. See how sharp the bend is with the pencil, and how round with your thumb.

The sharpness gives the high frequencies/more treble with the pointe pick. My main mandolin has a pretty loud bass, so I have never liked the round picks, because I want more high tones.

You pay your money and you take your choice.

Spencer

[Dolamon]

I'm with Glauber ... The Clayton Ultem's with two, differently modified 'corners', all polished up to 2400 grit. The only difference is I've gravitated to the thinner series of picks, .80, .96 and even down to .073. It is interesting to me that when you start removing some of the percussive surface (rounding the corners with two different radius'), the playing surface / texture changes dramatically.

When I started shaping the corners, I found I could go to thinner picks and wouldn't loose volume or tone. The Ultem / Ultex matrix picks are an interesting choice - even if that stuff is REALLY a hard compound.

Spencer's analysis is probably right on but ... it seems to me, in tremolo or pulsed double stops, the more pointed 'high frequencies' aren't the most desireable sound. But that's what I hear.

Your results may vary ...

[mando bandage]

Rounded tip with a sharper bevel on the edge than a Dawg is my all around choice. Seems like the rounded tip picks place a premium on grip for dynamic range: grip it tighter and drive through the strings for more volume, loosen up for the soft passages.

R

[onlyagibsonisgoodenuff]

Seems like I go through this dilemma every 6 months or so. #I started off with a compromise - a d'Andrea tri-corner pick which to me, was a bit more rounded that the classic teardrop shape. #I then switched to a genuine tortoise shell pick in the same shape, but found I did not like it. #I then went to a thinner, pointier shape (think Clayton) in tortoise shell and found that worked well for about a year.
Wow, Pete, it takes you 6 months to a year to get tired of a particular pick? I will sometimes go on stage with as many as four different kinds of picks for just one set! In my defense, I saw Butch Baldassari do that one time at a festival.

I also have trouble with the rounded picks. It seems to me they just slide up and over the strings without disturbing them much. The pointy ones seem to reach out and grab the string on their way, kinda like your dog does to the doorjamb when you drag him into the bathroom to take a bath.

One of my new favorites is the new Jim Dunlop gel picks. I especially like the yellow one, XH, which works out to be about 1.14mm. This pick has a great release, but enough thickness to really provide some nice tone. So far, I've only been able to find a teardrop shaped one. Tomorrow, it will be something else!

[mpeknox]

There's a mathematical procedure for calculating and breaking down the structure of waves (Fourier analysis). It basically says you can construct any wave form by adding up a (potentially endless) number of waves of increasing frequencies (harmonics), where the each harmonic is multiplied by a number you need to calculate, which determines how loud that harmonic is.
That's what I was gonna say before Spencer beat me to it!!
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[mandopete]

Wow, Pete, it takes you 6 months to a year to get tired of a particular pick? I will sometimes go on stage with as many as four different kinds of picks for just one set! In my defense, I saw Butch Baldassari do that one time at a festival.
I've thought about doing that sometimes Fred. #I have another problem in that I have switch off between guitar and mandolin and I'm really in a pick dilemma on the guitar.

Long story short, I had a pick I loved for the guitar, but no idea what it was or where I got it. #Then one of my kids decided to "borrow" t for use on his Strat and that's the last I've seen of it.

But I digress, I have 4 genuine tortoise picks, 1 pointy, 2 d'Andrea shaped medium point and one Dawg style rounded and I use them all. #I'm just scared to try to take them all on stage and potentially lose them as they represent a $200 investment.

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[mikeyes]

There probably isn't an ideal pick although I have found that each of my mandolins requires a different pick to get the best sound.

For one thing our techniques change (for the better, I hope) and our tastes change which means that what sounded good last year might not this year and the type of pick may change accordingly. I find that I have to change picks when I change styles (BG to Irish for example) because the licks are different and that if I am playing more percussive rhythm I need a different pick.

As a result, I have a stash of hundreds of picks (in fact many are on tour with CoMando right now) and will dip into that stash if I feel dissatisfied with my playing to see if it makes a difference.

I usually go back to my standards, but I also have been dabbling with classical styles and have found the value in the various types of picks that that segment of our group favor.

Pick selection is not a "set it and forget it" thing, rather it is one of the variables we have to look at to continue to improve tone and technique.

[mandopete]

Pick selection is not a "set it and forget it" thing, rather it is one of the variables we have to look at to continue to improve tone and technique.
Right On Mike!

[mandopete]

Just for grins, here's my "pick family"....

[futrconslr]

what are they from left to right?

[mandopete]

what are they from left to right?
Picks.

[mandopete]

Sorry...

These are all TS picks that I have collected over the years.

[Igor The Cat]

i use a Turtle pick for that great bluegrass chop, a Wegan bluegrass model for more mellow bluegrass, a Dawg for that special Jazz tone and a homemade teflon for when i dont want anypick noise AT ALL!

-Igor The Cat:p

[futrconslr]

i kinda steped into that one huh pete? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif I like the shape of the 3rd one from the left.

[jasona]

Pointy Proplecs are my pick of choise these days.

[mandopete]

I like the shape of the 3rd one from the left.
That is a TS pick that has been shaped to the D'Andrea Pro-Plec tri-corner shape. #I have used this shape for quite a while and it's a nice compromise between a point and rounded edge.

Here's kind of how I see these shapes (L to R):

1) Clayton tri-corner
2) Clayton/D'Andrea tri-corner
3) D'Andrea tri-corner
4) Dawg

[ira]

i use a variety of picks for a variety of purposes. some softer some harder some rounder some pointier, though these days almost all are larger triangles for easier grip and greater amount of attack possibilities.