How long do you take to learn a new song?

[muzicfreak]

Just out of curosity how long does everyone take to learn a new song? How many songs do you think you learn in a month.. I'm just trying to see where i might stand.. It seems i take a long time to learn new songs.. and it feels like i just learn the melody way to long.. and not enough chord changes.. Trying to make some changes to my daily practice routine..
any help would be great
thanks! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

[onlyagibsonisgoodenuff]

I've never really figured out how long it takes, but I can say that the more you do it, the easier it gets. It also depends on whether I'm attempting to learn the tune note-for-note or just my own stylized version. Often I just can't wrap my brain around what's on the record or written in the book, but if I come up with my own version, it's much quicker. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[250sc]

I normally pick up 3 to 5 new songs or solos a month. When I am learning them I play them every day to lock them into memory. I'll often play the new song exclusively for at least a few days. I'll take short breaks and play something else to give my hands a rest from the new shapes that I'm learning but soon I'll go back to the new song.

I also will whistle the new material while going about my daily routine.

Good luck.

[Scotti Adams]

I would think that would depend on the complexity of the song....Im learning new breaks in my head every day.....coming up with different variations to breaks...composing them to different keys..that forces you to learn the fingerboard...using the pinky etc.

[John Flynn]

I kept a list of the fiddle tunes I learned the first year I got into old-time. It came in at around 50, so about one a week. The following two years it's been less, maybe 30 a year, but those two years I've had less free time because of work. I also found I've forgotten a few of the ones I learned the first year because I haven't played them since I learned them. As far as the actual hands-on time it takes to learn a tune, that really varies. I've learned some tunes in 10 minutes. Others have taken many hours to get completely up to speed.

I agree with the earlier poster who said it gets easier the more you do it, but I have one caveat to that: The more I do it, the more ambitious I get to learn harder tunes, and that slows me down again. I'm working on some tunes now that have vexed me for months!

My instructor, who knows a ton of tunes, says that how fast you learn a tune (assuming you have the basic playing skills) is all dependent on careful listening and having the tune in your head. He says how much you like a tune is a factor also. It's much easier to learn a tune you really like.

[Ray Neuman]

I fully agree Johnny. I started sitting in with some wonderful musicians at the local jam sessions, and it was a SHOCK to me. I have been playing guitar for 30 years, and flatpicking and fiddle tunes were a completely new world to me.SO, I chose Arkansas Travelor as my first "entry" level tune to learn. I spent a week getting it down, and was FIRED UP to get back to the jam session to impress the boys.

I learned it in the wrong key. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

SO, i took the next week and learned it in the "right" key and started the next. I am learning the tunes on both guitar, and mandolin. I would say getting a couple down a month is great work indeed!

the sore fingered professir

[jimbob]

It takes me a long time to learn a tune because I am still learning the fundamentals too. If I know a song in my head, I can fake along with it, but learning new tunes from an instructional DVD or out of a book takes me some time. I have Sam Bush's DVD and have learned seberal of those tunes. It seems like they are getting a little easier after a year of hammering out by myself here in Africa. I have played some instrument almost all my life ( at least since I was 8 )....the mando is a big adjustment for me and I am trying to get the basics down more solidly than I did on the banjo...I really suck on the banjo, but all self-taught with little talent. The mandolin deserves more attention to detail !

[Daniel Nestlerode]

For me it depends on whether I am learning a fiddle tune or a song.

Songs come pretty quickly. #Most songs have a simple verse-chorus structure, so there are only two parts to remember (maybe a 3rd if there's a bridge). #The hardest part is memorizing the lyrics, but once that's done I can sing the song even when I'm away from an instrument. #This makes learning the song that much faster and easier.

Fiddle tunes are generally structured the same way as songs (most fiddle tunes are indeed songs that people in the BG and old Timey traditions have decided to stop singing). #But because I am forced to play the melody on the mandolin, a skill I have not developed as much as singing, it takes a little longer to come along. #Once I have the melody in my head (humming it does help a great deal) I still need to learn the fingering and to be able to do it at speed. #

I've been working on "Soldier's Joy" for a couple of months now. #I can hum it in my sleep, but geting my fingers to play it as fast as I can hum it is a different matter entirely! #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

best,
# # Daneil

[250sc]

DNestler,

Playing the material as fast as you would like is another issue. I've learned lots of songs but that doesn't mean I can play them at blazing speeds. I think the key is memorizing and understanding the material. Speed will come in time if you work on it.

When I first started playing mando I decided I wanted to learn Little Rock Getaway. The song was way beyond me but I worked on it measure by measure at a slow speed until it was memorized. Over the years I've played that song I have increased the speed and learned some ways of soloing over the changes but the speed came gradually.

Speed is nice if you can do it but if you can't, you shouldn't slop your way through anyway. Learn it slow but with a musical drive. I often play songs that should be played fast as a ballad so I have time to think through different musical ideas.

[John Flynn]

I think any tune you can play slow you can play fast if you are willing to put in the work with the metronome. You find a tempo that you can play it perfectly and then you start bumping up the speed a notch at a time, moving on when you can play perfectly at the new speed. For some tunes, it may take weeks to get it to "blazing speed," but eventually it gets there.

[Michael H Geimer]

DNestler, I think you 'stole' my post. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

I can learn your typical I-IV-V-ish Bluegrass song without even picking up an instrument. I'll put an MP3 into iTunes, tape the lyrics to my desk and let the song 'waft' through my brain all day. By 5pm I can usually grab my guitar and play it for the guys before I go home. ( It's great practice! )

Fiddle Tunes are whole different animal. First off, it's often difficult to find a basic recording in order to get the melody 'in my head'. But, even after I play a fiddle tune off sheet music enough to get how it's supposed to go ... well, then there's the whole muscle memory thing. So, it can take me a few weeks to really get a fiddle tunes sounding like a tune.

I don't do verbatim stuff anymore, where I try to exactly replicate a certain arrangement, but I've done that sort of stuff before and it takes me even longer. I recall taking weeks just to work out little ornimentations and turnarounds in some piano pieces. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[fatt-dad]

Man, I can learn a tune really fast! I just can't learn it up to tempo and can't recall how to kick it off. Take for instance, "Old French". Well, I know for certain that I know that tune. I just can't (right now) recall how it begins. If I saw the first three or four notes, I could play the whole thing (and pretty much up to tempo). So, I take my time going over and over the tunes getting them to come to my blank mind.

Is this age-related? Message to the youth of the Cafe, "Enjoy it while you have it" - ha.

fatt-dad

[Darryl Wolfe]

I would think that would depend on the complexity of the song....
Swing 51 took a few seconds longer Cripple Creek http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[davestem]

Depends how long I get to work on it...two-part fiddle tunes in open positions take 2 practice sessions (maybe an hour per session), and then revisiting them every once in a while over the next month or so.

What really, really helps get it burned into memory is recording the song. If I record a fiddle tune, passing off from mando to guitar and back to mando a couple of times (overdubs, obviously), that sucker's gonna be burned deeply in memory. I think it's the added concentration from thinking "If I don't get it right this time, I'll have to do it over..."

[angrymandolinist]

I'm all over the map on that one. It took me at least a week to learn "Carolan's Welcome" at a decent tempo and maybe an hour to learn "Rose Division," which I had never even heard of until I picked a random tune out of the Fiddler's Fakebook.

Jimbob- Wow, you're all the way out in Africa? See a lot of mbiras around?

[duuuude]

Learnin' the changes: A day

Learnin' the tune: A lifetime

[cameron]

Limerock may take a while longer than some other tunes.

[Brad Weiss]

Bill Evans is reported to have said: I'd rather spend 12 hours working on one tune than 1 hour working on 12 tunes.

I second the duuuude!

[Scotti Adams]

I would think that would depend on the complexity of the song....
Swing 51 took a few seconds longer Cripple Creek http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
..Aint that the truth Darryl.

[Jeffrey Lewis]

Takes hearing the tune three times.

If all i have to do is read it i can learn a song in a day or less. If i have to memorize it, it takes a couple of days. I probably learn more then 10 tunes a month at least.

[jimbob]

angrymandolinist ....I don't know what a "mbira" is, so I don't know whether I have seen any or not...
The best thing about being here is that there is time to learn the mandolin ( TRY to learn ) becasue there isn't much else to do, besides work ! When I get home, I am going to evry BG festival I possibly can !!!

[angrymandolinist]

They're also called kalimbas or thumb pianos... made of gourd with a wood top, with a bridge that holds metal keys. I've heard they're getting less and less popular, so I wouldn't be surprised if you haven't seen them around.

[Jack Roberts]

forever

[jimbob]

tons of "thumb pianos"....built very cheap for tourists...they are all over the place

[Tennessee Jed]

Sometimes it takes me weeks. Sometimes I never get it right. Sometimes I think about a song that I've heard and noodle around and play it in a few minutes. Sometimes I'll hear a song on the radio or TV, grab my mando, and play along even though I've never played it before. I can't explain why any of these things happen the way they do.

[Peter Hackman]

A lifetime. A really good song is something you live with, blow on, create variations on, try with different beats,
in different keys,etc. I know more stuff than songs!

[JGWoods]

A reeeeeaaaaallly long time. I have been playing Soldiers Joy for 40 years and I still learn new things to do with it. At best, in hindsight when I look back at a year I learn may 5-10 tunes, and 2 or 3 of them well. Well enough to play fast, with variations, in a couple of keys, and on 2 or 3 instruments, maybe not even that much.

If I average it out over 40 years of playing different instruments it probably comes out to less than 2 tunes a year as I can only play 50-75 tunes and then only if I find a list to tell me what I know!

sure is fun though
best
jgwoods

[MandoJon]

If I can hear the music and follow it with the dots at the same time, it takes me about an hour to learn and memorise a standard celtic-folk fiddle tune. It then takes about a dozen repetitions to get up to a reasonable speed and the same again to get up to Warp speed.

If I have to do it by ear alone, you can trebble the time.

If I have to do it from the dots alone you can quadruple the time.

If I have to do it from TAB alone you can quintuple the time and then add another day.

I have learnt a lot less than an average of 50 or even 30 tunes a year, mainly because I got to a point where I found the standard tunes weren't stretching me and, instead of getting into jazz/classical or trying out advanced ornaments/embelishments I got bored and put my mandolin down for a few years (a sad reflection on my impatience, but at least I'm honest!). Now I regret it and am trying to make up for lost time, not by trying to learn 100 tunes in a year, but by trying to push my techniques and experiment with music from different genres - hey I, might even try Bluegrass one day http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[TheNaivePicker]

..Takes me about 5 months to compose my own song these days. Seems like it anyhow, I've never been the best composer. #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif #On the other hand, It doesnt take that long for me to learn a song, persay a traditional song or something, maybe a few days or so..

[bsimmers]

I think it was Bela Fleck who said to learn it until you can play it without thinking about it.